Moderator Kenrae Posted June 2, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 2, 2021 I see them as always... 🤔 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geek0 Posted June 2, 2021 Share Posted June 2, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, Kenrae said: The rest of the patch is good but I don't understand taking out the judges, unless it's substituted by something else. It was a source of some strategy in battles, the least important of all but everything counts for those who want to optimize. 9 hours ago, Xemnas said: I fully agree: i mean some times was "ah this judge is not good for me, i'll wait to fight this person". It gave some help in the fights on who was stronger than you too, sometimes i'm pretty sure i won only thank to the right judge. For now i don't think i like this decision, maybe are they gonna change the pvp system again as you are guessing with your first sentence ? Well for now (if this is definitive) thank you judges, i miss you all already (i had even some nicknames for them) 😭. Now there is (literally XD) a huge hole in the pvp (screen) that nothing can fill. Happy retiring 🖖 I also fully agree with that! I even made a forum thread about it a few days ago. Perhaps not everything should be discussed. Nothing more from my end! Edited June 2, 2021 by geek0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makinen Posted June 2, 2021 Share Posted June 2, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, Kenrae said: I see them as always... 🤔 I'm using Chrome on Nutaku, which browser and platform are you on? Edit: Nevermind, it looks like it's back to normal for me as well Edited June 2, 2021 by Makinen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windia Posted June 2, 2021 Share Posted June 2, 2021 1 hour ago, Makinen said: I'm using Chrome on Nutaku, which browser and platform are you on? Edit: Nevermind, it looks like it's back to normal for me as well _That_ was the reason. On nutaku I had it huge and on HeH I had it normal. On topic: well, retireing the judges is more or less in line with the Seasonal way of fighting: I could never see the judge before the fight started. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geek0 Posted June 2, 2021 Share Posted June 2, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, windia said: On topic: well, retireing the judges is more or less in line with the Seasonal way of fighting: I could never see the judge before the fight started. Well, maybe that was up to you. The referees were everywhere (ToF, villians & arena). So maybe you could have looked at the villains before ToF or Arena fights. And they were also displayed in ToF fights after you had confirmed an opponent (challenge button) but not yet attacked (perfom button). Nevertheless, RIP On another note, would be great to know why Kinkoid decided to remove them. Just like with the one star girls in Patch Notes #20, quote: "These changes are made due to community feedback on one-star girls." Edited June 2, 2021 by geek0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpanda Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 I was curious what browsers were supported or if that was written somewhere, I guess you can tell by the outcry :] I rejoiced at the music bug fix only hours later to be auto logged out and the music playing 😜 1/2 there. Thanks for the rest 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator DvDivXXX Posted June 3, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 3, 2021 Well, this patch came with more than what the patch notes mentioned, as is often the case. There's some good, some bad, and some ugly. The Good: New quest, side quests future feature getting tested on the test server. Minor sound bug fix mostly for mobile users (I think, because PC users can always just mute the tab they open the game in). Good. Not mentioned anywhere and I don't even know if that came with the recent patch or who knows how long ago, but I've noticed (purely by chance because one of their pics was used for a recent Twitter contest) that Alpha and Omega had a nice little art upgrade, including a fix of the atrocious double left-foot issue that they always had in some pictures. That's awesome! Guys, you really should announce this kind of great moves! ^^ There's no shame in accepting the praise when it's well deserved. Plus, I'd like to know ASAP when art is getting improved, rather than finding out later on by pure chance. There might be who knows how many more pics that got fixed already and that I still don't know about. Please, please, communicate on this kind of stuff. The Bad: Removal of the Judges, but more importantly the matching pose mechanic in battles (except for champions), which is the stealth nerf to battle tactics that isn't explicitly mentioned in the notes. Judges were there to somewhat influence the RNG of which pose gets picked for each round of a fight (although their actual impact had always been insanely overrated by the community at large, imho). But now the fact that your alpha is, say, Splitting Bamboo or Bridge literally changes nothing at all, ever (again except against champions, for whom pose selection is still a pretty big deal, thankfully). My guess is that this might be an attempt by Kinkoid to start balancing PvP, but unfortunately this doesn't help at all for that. It just makes battles easier and more predictable for everyone. Having a highlighted pose per round, or judges to select it with slightly different odds had no impact on PvP balance. This just dumbed down the game's battle mechanics a bit. What they need to address for balance is the fact that there are no fair fights in PvP by default due to their mind-boggling XP/Level-based power system. And that rewards are way too front-loaded for the lucky few at the very top of each league's ranks, ideally. Removal of support for regular web browsers, except for the "big four" by Mozilla, Google, Apple and Microsoft. That's also a stealth update, as the patch notes themselves only mention the error message you get when you happen to be using your own choice of browser. Mainly Opera, being the most efficient and popular of the banned ones. This just sucks and I fail to see the logic behind it. It's fine now, but I could have done without spending hours I don't have researching and testing stuff, deleting my cookies and so on. I'll be disguised as a Chrome user for now, and it seems stable enough, so whatever. Opera support seems to have been reintroduced later yesterday for the main game, but you still need the shenanigans to access the test server, by the way. Domain name change and tons of issues thereof for the forum. Mostly a ton of buttons and icons missing, and at least for a few of us (at the very least yours truly) having to jump through hoops like never before to access the forum again (and not on my regular browser yet, Opera. I'm using FF just so I can access the forum right now). Still slowly recovering from that one. Also not announced. The Ugly: The XP icon now has the flashy shading effect from GH. I preferred the sober version, but whatever. Judges were removed, but the empty space they used to occupy, as well as the giant "Get ready for sex!" text they used to say were left untouched. This looks awkward to say the least. All in all, not the best patch we've had lately. But I have faith in you guys. Next one will be awesome, I can sense it. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windia Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 (edited) once a while ago part of the patch notes was/is that the league snapshots got shortened to "live". Well, they may not be realtime and it helped to get rid of the overpowered stats some players had. Like I wrote at the change from "1-3" to "1-25" points to be considered a stimulous to use boosters the whole week - with the seems-to-be-hourly snapshots it is now a stimulous to be permaboostered. (Edit: I really like the change to 1-25 as it gives opportunities to all no-rush-possible-players) Why I think so? With 6h untouched values, I could easily take a 9h break to let league tokens refill and still fight both snapshots I placed the 9h break in. E.g. boosters run out 4 hours before end of snapshot 1 - I reattach them 1 hour before end of snapshot 2. And I will catch every player unboosted in either snapshot 1 or snapshot 2. With 1h untouched - I can barely have a 1h break before I need to reattach boosters. Because within the former 9h break are now 9 snapshots where an opponent might be unboostered. That means on the one hand that I would need to check each hour and once my "booster break" starts I would need to break the break early when I find an "important permaboostered" opponent unboostered. Bye-bye comfortable sleeps overnight and whatever in reallife... As someone else already summarized with all the events back to back and stuff - the game turned from "chill and play" to "be online every minute to miss no opportunity". Edited June 3, 2021 by windia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Slynia Posted June 3, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 3, 2021 (edited) Personally I find the removal of the judges as a good change, at least until they find a way to implement them better. Why? Well I've always disliked bad RNG. If the judges would've had 100% chance to choose a pose for their preferred class, then that would've been better. Because for example, having the KH judge choose a HC pose when you're fighting a HC player. <- That's a very bad mechanic to say the least, because you're never safe from the judges wrath even when there is a 5% chance for a HC pose to be chosen, meaning that the chance for the KH judge to chose specifically Doggy Style was 1.25%. What I'm getting at is that this was not a mechanic you could fully plan around or include in your battles. If like I said the KH judge would have a 100% to always choose a KH pose, then we absolutely can plan better and choose to fight KH opponents now or wait and hope that they didn't apply boosters before the judge change and stat snapshot. At the same time, we won't risk and suffer from bad RNG against the other 2 classes during that time. Well, this is just how I'd have preferred it over how it actually was, not saying that they should implement them back like this though. Forgot to mention that the judges never acted as something positive in my fights that I could use to my advantage, they were always only something I tried to avoid against the wrong opponents, but of course this is probably because I'm on top of the food chain and never needed that extra 5% damage anyway. So for me personally this is more of a good than that of a bad change. 🤪 Edited June 3, 2021 by Slynia 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Kenrae Posted June 3, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 3, 2021 3 hours ago, Slynia said: Personally I find the removal of the judges as a good change, at least until they find a way to implement them better. Why? Well I've always disliked bad RNG. If the judges would've had 100% chance to choose a pose for their preferred class, then that would've been better. Because for example, having the KH judge choose a HC pose when you're fighting a HC player. <- That's a very bad mechanic to say the least, because you're never safe from the judges wrath even when there is a 5% chance for a HC pose to be chosen, meaning that the chance for the KH judge to chose specifically Doggy Style was 1.25%. What I'm getting at is that this was not a mechanic you could fully plan around or include in your battles. If like I said the KH judge would have a 100% to always choose a KH pose, then we absolutely can plan better and choose to fight KH opponents now or wait and hope that they didn't apply boosters before the judge change and stat snapshot. At the same time, we won't risk and suffer from bad RNG against the other 2 classes during that time. Well, this is just how I'd have preferred it over how it actually was, not saying that they should implement them back like this though. Forgot to mention that the judges never acted as something positive in my fights that I could use to my advantage, they were always only something I tried to avoid against the wrong opponents, but of course this is probably because I'm on top of the food chain and never needed that extra 5% damage anyway. So for me personally this is more of a good than that of a bad change. 🤪 While I agree that they could have been much better designed, that doesn't mean you didn't need to plan around them. At the end of the league your points would be less if you didn't take them into account, like anything else RNG dependant. On your last paragraph, that was my experience too, and I guess any high level competitive player. That doesn't mean it's a good change, in the end it's a competition so what matters is how you do compared to others. If a player planned around them and another player didn't do it properly, the first one had an advantage that now has disappeared. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Slynia Posted June 3, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 3, 2021 6 minutes ago, Kenrae said: that doesn't mean you didn't need to plan around them. I never said that tho? Even I did plan around them, but what I was getting at was that you were unable to ever fully take advantage of or plan around them thanks to bad RNG existing (every pose always had a chance to show up), sure your chances were better with certain judges but never for certain (this certainty is needed to fully being able to plan ahead your fights). Because the judges was too random for my own personal taste, I found them as just another RNG affix that didn't add anything important or interesting, hence why I think taking them out until being better implemented is a "good change" for the moment. 15 minutes ago, Kenrae said: If a player planned around them and another player didn't do it properly, the first one had an advantage that now has disappeared. Absolutely, however, we're talking about ~5 points in 300 fights (usually 100 opponents in D3), and we both know the gap is usually larger than that, but I agree that that's undoubtedly still an advantage non the less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Kenrae Posted June 3, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 3, 2021 We more or less think the same, it's just that they're taking out strategic options and making the league duller - even if this one wasn't important and was badly designed. I still don't have hard data, but I think they've completely taken out the snapshots in the process. That's a huge change and a horrible one, if that's true the league has become boring all of a sudden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windia Posted June 3, 2021 Share Posted June 3, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Kenrae said: [...] I still don't have hard data, but I think they've completely taken out the snapshots in the process. That's a huge change and a horrible one, if that's true the league has become boring all of a sudden. what gameplay conclusion/consequences do you make when snapshots have been removed completely? For me it is "I need to be online every then and now to see if I can catch someone former boosted player". And that any equipment change on my side will be reflected instantly. So I will have no "safe time slot" to hit Champions with crap to avoid to much progression like for PoA or LC. That is what I count horrible. Far too time consuming. As horrible as I described it back then when it was announced the first time in patch notes. Edited June 3, 2021 by windia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Slynia Posted June 3, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 3, 2021 12 minutes ago, Kenrae said: I still don't have hard data, but I think they've completely taken out the snapshots in the process. That's a huge change and a horrible one, if that's true the league has become boring all of a sudden. All I can say that there is a guy in my league whos stats has not been updated to the stats from his profile for the past 2 hours. A bunch of players' stats were also updated around ~18 (6 PM) server time in my bracket. So the snapshots seems to still be there for me at least. Or was there something else entirely you were thinking about and I'm just out cycling right now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Kenrae Posted June 3, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 3, 2021 1 minute ago, Slynia said: All I can say that there is a guy in my league whos stats has not been updated to the stats from his profile for the past 2 hours. A bunch of players' stats were also updated around ~18 (6 PM) server time in my bracket. So the snapshots seems to still be there for me at least. Or was there something else entirely you were thinking about and I'm just out cycling right now? No, I just had a bunch of people change stats between three hours ago (~20) and some minutes ago, and while we've seen some of that lately this was many more people than usual. I guess it's been a coincidence then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Kenrae Posted June 3, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 3, 2021 11 minutes ago, windia said: what gameplay conclusion/consequences do you make when snapshots have been removed completely? For me it is "I need to be online every then and now to see if I can catch someone former boosted player". And that any equipment change on my side will be reflected instantly. So I will have no "safe time slot" to hit Champions with crap to avoid to much progression like for PoA or LC. That is what I count horrible. Far too time consuming. As horrible as I described it back then when it was announced the first time in patch notes. It seems I was wrong, which is a good thing. On your assessment if that were to happen, I agree and I'd add something else: it would be not only time consuming, but mindlessly so, there would much less strategy in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmandaMoon Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 On 6/2/2021 at 10:52 PM, jpanda said: I rejoiced at the music bug fix only hours later to be auto logged out and the music playing 😜 1/2 there. Eh? Pardon me? Sorry I couldn't hear you over the sudden music blasting from my speakers. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hastur Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 Are recently-archived Patch Notes still publicly available anywhere? Specifically, the official Patch Notes from ~10 February 2021 regarding the release of Club Champions? Since the restructuring of this topic & the Kinkoid blog I can't seem to find it anywhere. I even tried Discord but now my eyes are bleeding. 😭 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windia Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 40 minutes ago, Hastur said: Are recently-archived Patch Notes still publicly available anywhere? Specifically, the official Patch Notes from ~10 February 2021 regarding the release of Club Champions? Since the restructuring of this topic & the Kinkoid blog I can't seem to find it anywhere. I even tried Discord but now my eyes are bleeding. 😭 I guess the nutaku page is the "best" place: https://www.nutaku.net/games/harem-heroes/news-updates/ (as the KK blog moved somewhere I did not bother to look out for) 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hastur Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 4 minutes ago, windia said: I guess the nutaku page is the "best" place: https://www.nutaku.net/games/harem-heroes/news-updates/ (as the KK blog moved somewhere I did not bother to look out for) Wow, thank you- I didn't realize that even existed! 👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Observer_X Posted June 4, 2021 Share Posted June 4, 2021 A new adventure scroll is always welcome. I don't like the retiring of judges (and the "permanence" of the "get ready for sex" balloon is weird, to say the least, as it is seeing an empty space in the combat screen where the judges were) but that is entirely personal. The fixing of the sound bug deserves definitely a "two thumbs up": I found that bug quite annoying. About the browser supporting, I would like to make a question about a detail: does the message appear when the site is loaded or when the player tries to log in? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator DvDivXXX Posted June 5, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 5, 2021 12 hours ago, Observer_X said: does the message appear when the site is loaded or when the player tries to log in? As soon as you open the site. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lepidocter Posted June 8, 2021 Share Posted June 8, 2021 I always thought of referees more as a decor than a gameplay feature, to me they could have been just art in the background, so nuke them into voidness sound a bit drastic. A reasonable RNG is not an issue in any game, if you can plan every outcome in advance there's no reason to play. 5% that happen 5% of rounds WAS reasonable. Maybe they can spare some server resource this way. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karyia Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 Questions about the last patch: a) how do we know the reward for each side quest? (example: doesn't seem worth it to me to spend energy to get an epic item/gift) b) do the side quests have a limited duration or will they be there until they get complete? Also, will sort of pre-survey and predict people will (possibly) be asking for more energy 😅😁 As for Mythic Days, I would suggest 4h rounds with 18k shards available during 3 days -> 324k shards. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Kenrae Posted June 9, 2021 Moderator Share Posted June 9, 2021 4 minutes ago, Karyia said: Questions about the last patch: a) how do we know the reward for each side quest? (example: doesn't seem worth it to me to spend energy to get an epic item/gift) What? Do you prefer to use it to get Champion Tickets? 😅 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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