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@DvDivXXX

Needless to say, I disagree with everything you wrote in your post about my play style, my experience about the game and how it should be played, and my no-koban policy making me inadequate as representative of the average free players. And, by the way, you are wrong too: actually my no koban policy is still in place, although the time when I will suspend it draws near. But now none of you guys will know about that anymore.

I felt this one coming since the time I answered your post after you hide one of mine and you invited me on Discord. I realized that you were slowly falling down the same slope that made me hate George and his behaviour to the point of reporting him (worthlessly, despite a seemingly initial positive answer) to the team, and that made me really sad, but never as sad as today knowing that I can no longer call friend a person with whom I have always thought I was talking to on a plan of parity, only to find that he had such a low opinion of me. Given what you wrote, I am astonished that you didn't report me to the team to be banned from the game. A game that I won't abandon unless I will be forced to, or my patience becomes exhausted because playing becomes impossible... but now none of you guys will know abouth this either.

If I write on a forum, I write my opinion: either I am free to say what I think, always respecting the rules of the forum, or I am not. Now I know I'm not, so I assure you this will be my last post on this forum. From now on I will limit myself to reactions to other people's posts. Needless to say, a lot of people will have to expect a lot of "What the..." from me.

My farewell goes to my friend @jelom and any other player who didn't find my way of playing this game stupid, or my opinions and complaints about it worthless.

You can safely avoid replying, as even if I saw a reply in the forum notifications, I would just mark the thread as already read.

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Hey @Observer_X

21 minutes ago, Observer_X said:

If I write on a forum, I write my opinion: either I am free to say what I think, always respecting the rules of the forum, or I am not.

If I have any say in it, I'd stand by "you are welcome and free to do it".

 

It became personal between you two. So I hope you won't mind my intervention here.

I find your self imposed restriction curious. I have this "I wanna be game designer" bit still alive in me, so when I read your feedback posts, I remind myself that there are other players in this game that would have limited access to kobans. Like from inefficient spending or not participating enough in game activities to earn significant amounts in a month. Your posts can get me thinking. Not necessarily every time xD. But it can happen.

If I read @DvDivXXX right, the core of his disagreement with you lies with the danger of misleading some of the players or devs and CMs with your feedback and suggestions, unless you put enough warning signs "I play it with no kobans rule".

And there is another part of your post above. But it's half personal and half modding talk, and so maybe better left outside of the public parts of the forum.

 

22 minutes ago, Observer_X said:

Now I know I'm not, so I assure you this will be my last post on this forum. From now on I will limit myself to reactions to other people's posts.

I'm sorry to hear read that. I hope you reconsider. tbh I was looking forward to reading your reaction posts after you lift your "no koban" restriction.

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@Observer_X Well, if you're going to take my post this personally and this badly (and misread most of it, starting with the core message)... This is probably for the best.

Your reaction seems overly dramatic and reeks of misdirected anger and long-time frustration. I'm sorry you feel that way, but you were derailing a thread with a non-issue that only you feel strongly about, and that had to stop. I won't correct all of the incorrect assumptions you've shown in the post above, it would be a waste of my time and yours. Hopefully you don't mean half of it anyway (why would anyone want a player banned from a game because they're not playing it very well?). And I don't have a low opinion of you in general. I never made a secret of how bad I consider your no-koban policy and its consequences on your game progress. I like you and appreciate many posts you've made and discussions we've had, just not on strategy or game balance in particular. How can this be a surprise for you by now?

I know you like black and white environments and law-like rules. That's not how we roll, here, though. You're not 100% free to do something or 0% allowed to do it. We're a forum community, not a court room. I haven't changed and this context-based moderation style has been in place for a long time. Your communication style and George's clashed hard and a lot of your countless exchanges had a broken-record feel to them honestly. There was never anything like that between you and me, at least I never perceived it that way. But yeah, I've always agreed with George and any good player of the game's full version that your own self-imposed kobanless version is terrible and could only lead to a big crash after a long series of disappointments and frustration. And I also don't want your feedback strictly based on your self-imposed limitations to take more space than it should in discussions about the actual full game. As was clearly the case here, because yeah, any free player who does use their free kobans can do this PoV fairly easily. So you were moving into off-topic territory with your insistence that this PoV was too hard. Nothing more, and nothing less.

If you can't accept that without demonizing me, our many nice conversations over the years, my moderation style, or even the forum as a whole... Well, that's too bad. It makes no sense to me, and I'm sad to see you go if it actually comes to that.

Anyway. This isn't your first Farewell Tour, so to speak, and I'll be surprised if you don't make a forum comeback in the near future. Hopefully in a better disposition. Take care of yourself, in any case.

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27 minutes ago, FinderKeeper said:

If I read @DvDivXXX right, the core of his disagreement with you lies with the danger of misleading some of the players or devs and CMs with your feedback and suggestions, unless you put enough warning signs "I play it with no kobans rule".

It isn't exactly that. The thing is that Obs tends to use "me, myself and I" and "your average free player" interchangeably in his feedback, which is super misleading on its own, because he plays the game very very differently from an average player, F2P or otherwise. It's not always an issue, but in this particular case he insisted that this perfectly doable PoV was borderline impossible for an average F2P player, when it might be for him (and even that might be too pessimistic) and  he had sterile back and forth arguments with multiple other regulars on this. That was too much.

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On a side note, I'm super confused because I could swear he posted in ChitChat a few weeks ago about his koban spending results because he decided to start spending them as he felt the end (of the game) was near... I guess I misread that. It doesn't change much, either way. He's free to play however he likes, and to share however he feels about the game in his own personal experience, obviously. But he needs to be aware that his experience of the game is insanely harder, slower and more difficult than most players'. There's a bigger gap between him and the average free player than between the average free player and the average whale, honestly. So yeah, it's ridiculous for him to generalize his uniquely slow and limited progress as if it was just your average free player's.

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I´m kinda suprised by this 😮 .. I´ve totally missed the discussions that took place but after going back and reading through all of it I honestly can understand that the specific discussion lead to this ..well.. meltdown I´d say. Well I haven´t been part of the mentioned " discussions that tooked place" but I honestly don´t get the issue here:  @Observer_X is obviously a f2p player but not in the general sense since he decides to not spent kobans but players spending "free kobans" are also f2p/ the "normal" f2p players I´d say. There´s obviously nothing wrong with it if you decide to play it that way you can gladly do so but the point at which @DvDivXXX is getting is that you´re not the average f2p player so it can be misleading to state your feedback as if you were. (that´s how I understand it)

While I definitely don´t agree with you in the slightest about your opinion with the currently ongoing PoV
  (well the PoV is probably doable for every single player that just decides to log into the game once or twice a day everyday within the 2 weeks) but well that´s not the point here I suppose. Nevertheless I also share @FinderKeeper feedback : it´s saddening to hear/read and I also hope to see you and your posts again :)

 

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@Observer_X You should reconsider this decision, my friend. If you need a pause to rest it is good, but we will wait for your comments soon, it doesn't matter to me if they are right or wrong. Too many people has left the game and forum lately and it is not good losing one more. Don't take the moderators comments personally, sometimes written discourse intentions are misinterpreted, so take them as a normal opinion interchange between friends and don't get too much feelings about them.

And now in a general sense, I think that it is good having different opinions in the forum, first of all because it gives us different views about the issues, and reminds us that there are a lot of different people playing this game, each with his own playstyle and points of view. It is so true here as in real life. Don't take for granted that every person will behave like ourselves or will share the same tastes as we have.

 

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1 hour ago, lepidocter said:

Forget them as they doesn't know what they're doing.

I think you meant to quote “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.” (from the Jesus character in the first "The Bible" sequel; fairly popular one ^^). Though I'm not sure how you meant to apply that here.

1 hour ago, lepidocter said:

Italian version:

I think you meant to say "very long off-topic message that has nothing to do with the English quote, and in a foreign language that's not allowed in the English forum"... Do we even know for a fact that Obs speaks Italian? I thought he was from Eastern Europe.

Anyways, from what Google Translate was able to tell me, it seems about half of it is fairly innocent chit chat to cheer up Obs about forum moderation in general. The other half seems to be you explaining how confused you apparently are about the moderator role on this particular forum, and also about me as a person. The mod role isn't what you think it is, and we've explained this a billion times. I can't help it if other forum regulars keep assuming that having "Moderator" under my name automatically makes anything I say an official statement or a moderation ruling. By default, anything I post is as a forum regular, except when I'm actually moderating (and the difference between the two should be pretty clear most of the time). I'm... also very confused why you seem to think I consider myself an average player. I'm very obviously not and have never claimed so.

Anyways, I know Holy speaks Italian, but I'm not sure why your post just made him laugh and not react as a moderator, in this case. Maybe the bits Google was unable to translate correctly made the post funnier and more benevolent than it seems from my perspective.
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Still (MOD HAT ON! see? the following will be an actual moderation bit😞 Could you please remove your non-English post? Feel free to say the same things in English if it's relevant to this discussion. You might want to tone down or simply avoid personal attacks, towards anyone (in this case me though). Cheers. (MOD HAT OFF).

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1 hour ago, DvDivXXX said:

The mod role isn't what you think it is, and we've explained this a billion times. I can't help it if other forum regulars keep assuming that having "Moderator" under my name automatically makes anything I say an official statement or a moderation ruling.

Those who said it before were pointing at another thing. It's a difference between obligation and responsibility.

Yeah, I agree. People would still see us empowered and thus representing Kinkoid no matter how many CMs and Kinkoid staff would line up and say that we mods don't represent their views and values. But that what makes us responsible. Even vulnerable. We are dealing with people and have our measure of power over life experiences of others.

Keeping local climate in check is not a requirement to our role. But what we say DOES carry more weight, and so our status makes us more responsible.

Mod badge comes with a certain role. It does relate to community building. And that role makes a mod responsible for local climate and how forum operates.

We are not required to, but we influence it greatly.

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@FinderKeeper Definitely. It's no coincidence that most of us were already up to our knees in the forum's day to day life, typically with a rather positive influence and sending good vibrations, long before we were even offered the badge. And in at least one case, long after giving the badge back. All of us care, about the game, the forum and, most importantly, about the community. One of Noacc's biggest strengths as a CM is his flair for mod selection.

On the flip side, quite a few regulars see the badge and forget their fellow community member behind it. Or worse. And I've been at peace with that for awhile now. I won't name anyone else, but yeah, this isn't the first time someone I used to be in great terms with on the forum assumes I'm a completely different guy because of the badge. Been there, done that. Paid my dues. I'm not going on another "Save Private ___" mission ever again. If Obs really believe I went from "friend" to "Satan but worse" overnight because I had to moderate some of his stuff, of course it hurts, but so be it.
---------------

Anyways. The wife and I are going to see the new Matrix now. I hope this thread will have changed as per my previous moderation ruling when I come back. If not, I'll change it myself. Cheers.

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On 12/27/2021 at 5:34 PM, DvDivXXX said:

Anyways, I know Holy speaks Italian, but I'm not sure why your post just made him laugh and not react as a moderator, in this case. Maybe the bits Google was unable to translate correctly made the post funnier and more benevolent than it seems from my perspective.
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I didn´t really intent to come across like " I laughed at the post" hence why I didn´t react to it but just replied. (the smiley is more of a smirk/grins directed towards this part of his comment than laugh from my point of view so sorry if there has been a misunderstanding :))

 

On 12/27/2021 at 3:49 PM, lepidocter said:

English Version:

Forget them as they doesn't know what they're doing.

 

Italian version:

 .. @Observer_X is also Italian that´s why @lepidocter made a farely long "narrative" version is what I´d call it. From how I understand it it´s not meant as a malevolent attack towards you but rather a attempt to cheer Obs up :) (f.e. the referee example)since this post give off the tipical "lepidoctor comment vibes" to me. That´s why I didn´t understand it as a personal attack.

(MOD HAT on)
About the "off-topic"  part.. yeah this is the English forum but since it´s the "off topic" part and just a part of his comment I didn´t felt the need to "moderate it".. sure it´s technically not ok but too be honest there are a lot of other posts that fit the criteria as well (in the less active parts of the Englisch forum (off-topic,arts spot, ...) that why I feel like it´s not that big of an issue (well as long this stays at the one comment and doesn´t escalate into a whole discussion/ talk ..that would be a different story). I think it was just easier for @lepidocter to bring his point across in his native language rather than in English. :)

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The "mod hat on" thing is better used sparingly (or usually as a joke). I was not joking about @lepidocter posting a wall of text about me in a language I don't speak being unacceptable, though. Whether he was badmouthing me in it or not, this in and of itself is pretty rude. I should have made this clearer earlier on, then.

Google Translate for reference:

Quote

I was once banned from a fairly important forum for agreeing with a mod's views on a technical topic. Defendant, not quarrel. Another mod, a schizoid girl, banned me for "mysterious" reasons (she hated the other mod and ... I had hit her).

That of the forums is an insensitive, ugly world, where in reality everyone lives with their own drives and argues with the drives of others, over which they have no control. Like Facebook, but worse. Before understanding DivvuIcsIcsIcs it took me a while: sometimes it 'moderates' where it should 'participate', making believe that the intervention is official, in the same way as a yellow card from a referee. Instead he's just fooling around. He can't stop you from playing however you want, nor from having the opinions you prefer. At the most he can be answered that as you keep the Koban, I for some reason of my own keep the legendary items XD. Likewise the "average player" is able to spend an absurd amount of kobans to win in League 1, and that doesn't make him any more or less 'average' than us. We are all 'average' players, each with their own compulsions. To play 'perfectly' would be absurdly pallid and neurotic.

As far as I'm concerned, your policy of saving kobans is remarkable, it takes a lot of patience to resist all the stimuli of spending and it can be a fun challenge to practice (such as my storage of items or the selectivity of who to promote or not. ). If it slows you down, that's your *** after all.

Perhaps Divvudivxxxxxx does not realize that his voice, as a mod, can seem more authoritative than others and be intimidating, but I advise you to let it slip a little off you. Even he, despite everything, is an 'average player', he will do his shit like everyone else (maybe he only buys pink items, what do I know). And he doesn't often realize that the main focus of a mod is administering discussions, not always breaking thoughts about what the super-perfect strategy to win it all is, which doesn't give a damn but a small number of people I would never want to be with. to deal with.

Moving the fuck on. V_v

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On 12/27/2021 at 12:30 AM, Observer_X said:

From now on I will limit myself to reactions to other people's posts. Needless to say, a lot of people will have to expect a lot of "What the..." from me.

image.png

Very mature. Well, if that's all you're going to be from now on, then the actual last answer will be the warning you won't get to read as I'm banning you for a month, removing your ability to access the forum and act like a two years old. ESPECIALLY on such a serious post in a serious thread.

Grow the fuck up already. You're about my age, if I remember correctly... V_v

Needless to say, if you're not back to your senses when the temp ban expires, don't bother coming back.

Bye, now.

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