JustVisiting

You were given a one day holiday. I hope your clicking finger is well rested

I posted this in the Patch Notes thread, but felt it might be more appropriate to break it out into its own thread until we have a better idea of the new drop rates in the Permanent PoP (Level 10 all three): 1st round - 2x3MyP and 3GP. 2nd round - 2x4tickets and 3GP 3rd round - 3xMyP, 10 shards and 3GP Total: MyP: 3 GPx10: 0 Tickets: 2 Shards: 1 GP: 3

Someone in my club has suggested that the 3GP PoP is only on when you are at Level 10. Can anyone confirm this? If that were to be the case then the advice to other players would be to upgrade to a maximum of Level 9. A shame that I upgrade all 3 just over a week ago 😭

Yeah, I wish they'd just be upfront about the changes they're making. Rather than this 'advertise the changes that we think players will respond well to and sneek through those that they won't'. Ends up just feeling a bit like you're being hoodwinked.

When that was the case there was a even playing field though. None of you had had it. It's the removal after the existance that creates the imbalance. And it's been a long time now since anyone considered me a youngster lol. I should take the compliment 😛 Tbh I'm more acknowledging the dynamic than complaining. The truth is that basically every change KK make now has a lot of unintended consequences. KK are trying to manage the resource balance, so that they don't totally undermine their business by giving away too much away for free. So they're trying to reign in previous over-generosity. Reducing the Epic sphere drop rates, reducing the Kobans in seasons, reducing the PoP drop rates, reduced slots for xp/aff in the shop, I'm pretty confident there's been a recent reduction in the Challenge Ticket drop rate in both temp PoP and Daily Contests, I also suspect - though I'm not as confident on this - that there has been a reduction in the shard awards for the first event of this month. The concern is that KK don't realise the value of their f2p players. Or they simply don't see how these changes are impacting the dynamic of the game. If they engineer it to restrict too many of the free resources, and weight the game heavily enough that 'grinding' isn't enough for f2p to reach the top, a lot of f2p players will stop playing. The reality right now is that f2p is somewhat hanging by a thread. Getting enough Kobans to afford the Mythics is a LOT of hard work for anyone who isn't already doing well in D3. The more that KK skew the system in ways that favour the older players for winning the Kobans in the Daily Contests, the less likely they make it that any new f2p (or indeed low spend p2p) player can break through. If these players can't bank enough Mythics through the grind there's no possibility of them succeeding in D3. If they don't succeed in D3, they don't get the extra Kobans to narrow the gap. And that's the crux of this - yes there has been a resource inbalance with an awful lot getting given away for free, but this has already been significantly compensated for by introducing of Mythic girls/boosters. All of these free resources were simply currency to try and convert to Kobans to try and convert to the high value, and significantly high cost, assets. Taking away those free resources doesn't reduce the number of Koban in the game, but it does mean the Koban more likely to go to the group of players that needs them least. That's problematic.

Actually, thinking about it, if the GPx10 drop rate has been reduced, this has a secondary consequence for lower level players as well. I think it's reasonable to suggest that the Ymen excess that many senior players have identified is a consequence of the GPx10 orbs. Selling the items from these certainly seems to be the biggest part of my Ymen income. If the drop rate for GPx10 is reduced then players will end up with far fewer items and consequently far less Ymen. That is again no great loss (at least in the short term) for the established player who has trillions in the bank. But for the lower level player trying to work their way up, they are now going to have less Ymen to compete with these hugely bankrolled established players in any of the donation based Daily Contests. Lower competitivity = lower Koban income rate = less resources to spend to acquire valuable girls for your team. In fairness, this seems a less significant consequence than reducing the MyP orbs, but it does again skew the balance towards the older player, at least until such time as they've depleted their Ymen hoards.

I was 2x3MyP and 3GP. EDIT - 2nd round - 2x4tickets and 3GP EDIT - 3rd round - 3xMyP, 10 shards and 3GP Total: MyP: 3 GPx10: 0 Tickets: 2 Shards: 1 GP: 3

I certainly understand your perspective, but I'm not sure I agree regarding the end consequence. Firstly, all that's going to happen is that your going to be drowning in the most useless type of orb. It's not less clicks, it's the same number with lower points scored. If the problem was the clicks there's been no change. Unless you're going to ignore them, which is an option as they're close to worthless. However I think there's a more profound change been made to the balance of the game here. Those players who have been maxed out on the PoP for a long time and are flooded with MyP have had a significant period to drain the MyP pool of girls. Reducing the number of MyP orbs doesn't make a lot of difference to such players, especially considering that the need for Legendary boosters has also just been reduced. For younger players though, who still have a relatively full MyP pool, an avenue to gain ground has just been significantly curtailed. By reducing the MyP orb frequency they've reduced access to the girls that appear in this pool, meaning it will take longer to build up to similar harem numbers as the top end players. If this change has reduced the MyP drop rate (it is possible that it's only reduced the GPx10, the tickets or the shard drop rates) it further entrenches established players and makes it more challenging for newer players to catch up.

Thanks chaps. I generally finish Seasons tier 51 around the 17th-19th, but it makes me question whether I'm playing Seasons optimally. Perhaps by using every single regen, I'm pushing my Mojo total up quicker, meaning I get less per performance. Whereas if I missed some, my Mojo total would be lower at any given time and I'd receive more per performance, allowing for the wastage you discuss. And thanks Dv - I claim no rewards from Seasons unless there's an alternative (longer lasting) wallet to store them in (like girl XP, Aff, Pachinko etc) or I specifically need to use them.

Perhaps the more experienced D3 players can offer some insight here. I apologise if this post wanders around a bit through issues. I'm trying to assess the impact over multiple moving parts. The AM booster (+15% to damage when attacking in Leagues and Seasons for the next 100 battles performances). Is it common for D3 players to ignore Seasons? From what I've seen from the LC, that does NOT seem likely. In fact, the XP rewards from Seasons are generally fundamental to the first day's strategy. Assuming that Seasons is still important to most D3 players, then the AM booster creates a disincentive to skilled play as far as I can see. You put on your AM Booster, you now want to use the 100 performances in the League because you simply don't need them in Seasons. So your choice is now ignoring the natural regens of the Season performances until such time as you've used up the 100 booster performances, slowing your progress through the Season rewards, or Koban blasting the performaces in the League (from what I've seen some players do this successfully on the first day anyway) to burn through the 100 booster performances. If you go with the latter, you're going to have to disregard any efforts to catch players unboosted/on the Blessing change over. Yes, you've got a 15% boost against everyone, but is that going to give you as much as catching players unboosted? If that's correct, then this seems to significantly favor established players, over those lower level players trying to grind their way up. The 15% attack booster is great for a player who has less need of catching unboosted players. High level, already going to win most matches, squeezes extra points out. But for any player that relies on catching unboosted players to make up for their lower level, they're going to have to a) waste performances on Seasons as they HAVE to wait to catch players unboosted or b) ignore Seasons to conserve the performances. Ignoring Seasons doesn't seem a viable option, so that means that lower level players would have to spend more Kobans (due to wasting performances on Seasons) to be competitive than higher level players. Am I missing something?

There doesn't seem to be a 'shaking in my boots' reaction 😛

Setting aside the immediate double Blessing. That's random chance and could be the same for any Mythic ever released. I would also say I'm not advocating for not picking-up Mythics where you can. I'm simply thinking out loud regarding possible reasons that there are so many shards left this time round. The double Blessing should have increased demand for Arcana. I would suspect that for the majority of players getting every Mythic is not now and was not ever a reality. That's somewhat the point I was making. Even for f2p players, it was still possible to have the strongest team under the old system. Under the new system the 'whales' will still pick-up every Mythic. And those right at the top of D3 should be able to keep that pace up too (though if they end up taking a month off for any reason they're not going to have the free resources to cover the hole). But for many who aren't prepared to spend a lot of money or aren't already winning D3 - which is likely the vast majority of players, even in the D3 league - a bit of frustration may set in here. What's the point if I can't get everyone type thinking? "I can't win at D3 without them all." Personally, I think that's wrong and can accept I won't be competitive every week. Each Mythic simply gives me more chance of being competitive in any given week. But as I'm neither about to invest a lot of money, nor do I have the free resources to obtain a Mythic every month, I'll continue to be picky about when I go for one. One Mythic's much the same as the next to me, other than Bunna. So I'll build up the Koban bank so that I have 2 Mythics worth before I buy one. That way when Bunna comes up again, or another Mythic with a similar quirk (Abreal seems a possiblity), I'll be sure to have enough put aside to pick-up the slightly more valuable Mythic.

I do wonder whether they're reaching market saturation with Mythics. Under the old battle system there was an unspoken expectation that we would get 3 for each class and then something different might happen. That might have been a pause on releasing further Mythics, it might have releasing Mythics with slightly improved stats, it could have been revival events. But once we reached 3 of each, you maxed out the team. The reason to pick up more diminished. (I actually suspect that removing that glass ceiling on Mythic investment had a lot to do with the motivation to change the battle structure). Now every Mythic is valuable. Whereas before players were going for a) their own class to maximise their team (and there was a cap on how much of that they had to do) or b) the Mythics they found particularly appealing, now every Mythic becomes valuable to anyone competing in the leagues. In this manner KK have successfully increased demand for Mythics overall, but I suspect they've also decreased demand for them individually. Arcana's no more valuable than 8 of the 9 other Mythics (assuming that Blessings are weighted equally). There's nothing special to set her appart in the new battle system. Previously it was actually achievable to pick-up your own class Mythics (those that were most valuable to you) every 3rd month, with or without paying. If you aggressively saved your Kobans you could likely get one every 2nd month. With every Mythic now being of equal value it's no longer possible to target the Mythics that are most valuable too you - there's not time to save up unless you're already top 4ing D3 regularly or you're prepared to spend significantly. So setting aside the big spenders, this means that some players will choose which to go for by aestetic, and there's been some criticism of Arcana this month, while others will get frustrated and disengage as they can't get the best of everything now. There's now reason for me, and many others admittedly, to look to get more than 3 Mythics. But I don't think demand is going to be as high for them individually going forward unless they are specifically popular or there is something unique about them. Personally, I could pick up Arcana, but I'm going to wait until I have at least 2x what I need saved before picking up another Mythic, so if that 'special' Mythic comes along unexpectedly I have the resources available.

Seem to have reached a lot more excess shards a lot quicker this time round. Maybe I'm wrong about that, but I do wonder if demand for Arcana hasn't been as high. I could think of a few potential reasons for that.

Kobans have been reduced in Seasons again.....

@Kenrae - A like by itself doesn't really feel like an appropriate response. Thank you

I should have defined that it was Nutaku Kobans above and the end cost was 168, all spent on combativity and I got 26 shards for 5 star rare Rin along the way. That seems reasonable to me.

Surely optimising on defense, while not important for gaining your own points, is about preventing your competitors scoring additional points much like trying to minimise the windows where you are unboosted? With it being so competitive in D3, those 2-3 points might end up being the difference in bracket of finish. Obviously less important to stop each opponent gaining 2-3 additional points on you than ensuring you gain an additional 1-2 points in every fight, but still a possibility for optimisation. Now we're getting down to the meat and veg! By simulator I assume you mean this: Or is there some more expansive tool that allows you to sim a battle thousands of times and produce a bell curve of the results etc? Is there a resource to read about what the simulator is doing here beyond providing a estimated Ego/pts outcome with a basic traffic lighting system? Noted. I suspect the second point about reducing the number of turns is covered in the resource about the simulator I asked Kenrae about, but just in case, is there some way to derive this from the traffic lighted number seen above?

My motivation for being here is competition. I enjoy the competition. For me, it's the only long term engaging aspect of the game. As stated above, I do understand that the motivations for others make a difference to the value they get from spending their Koban in any particular manner. If you lump 3 and 5 star girls together and separate Mythics, yes you're going to make the majority of your team from the 3 and 5 stars. The majority of the best selections are 5 stars, but that's only true right now because there are 5-6x as many 5 star girls as their are Mythics. As the Mythic pool increases that will change. And more significant to this conversation, the opportunity to get 5 star girls from the PoA is very small. So to create a meaningful comparison you need to compare the girls you are actually likely to get vs Mythics as I did above showing that, roughly, your Mythic girl is likely to be more frequently picked as the best option for your team than even 12 3 stars. Or alternatively you could compare the 3 star girls to getting a couple of 5 star legendaries during the Legendary Days comp. Given the choice, I would again take the 5 stars every time. I specifically favoured the 3 star values in the above sums and minimised the Mythic value (I counted 3 stars as coming up 3 times a week - it appears to be slightly less - and Mythics coming up once a week - it appears to be slightly more) to ensure that my potential personal bias wasn't the concluding factor. I entirely understand if you have different motivations and that winning in the league is simply a way of funding picking up more girls. But my posts are from the pov of someone whose main priority is being more competitive as it is overcoming the challenge that I find most interesting. Correct. To be absolutely optimum you have to have everything all the time. But assuming that's not actually an option for you right now, your choice is between 12 3 stars and half a Mythic. Basic numbers show that the Mythic is going to end up benefitting your team more often than the 12 3 stars. (and tbh I didn't account for the times that the Mythic isn't one of the 7 best girls, but you can't field the 7 best girls and the Mythic is the next best girl. The 3 stars are even less likely to be the 'next best' girl as if they're double blessed they're likely to be in the top 7 and if they're not double blessed the chances are they're going to be beneath all of the unblessed Mythics) (I also didn't account for the fact that you're getting more for your Kobans this month on PoA and that most months it's not 12 girls available, it's 4-5 with 2.something being available without paying the 1.2k). If the choice was between a Mythic or every other girl then you take every other girl. No question. But with the constraints that actually exist, the Mythic is going to improve your team more. And you tend to get far more opportunities to pick-up the 3 star girls. They are reissued in the various beginning of month events or are put into the Pachinko pool etc etc. You could be waiting 9 months for your next shot at a specific Mythic.

I think you've perhaps over extended the point I was making. If given the choice would you rather have 1 Mythic (or 0.5 Mythics) or 12 3 star Epic/Legendaries for strengthening your battle team? I'm not suggesting that Mythics are the be all and end all. But unless you are able to put together the optimum team most weeks, chances are you're going to look to pad it out with a couple of Mythics. They're not always in the top 7 but unboosted Mythics are consistently highly placed (both this week and next week they're top 20 on both main and Nutaku servers). I wouldn't recommend having 7 Mythics as an optimum team simply because it's rarely optimum. My point was that how many weeks are you going to wait for one of those 12 girls to get double boosted vs how often is a Mythic likely to be more useful to you. (also remembering that you can likely get 4-5 of those girls without paying the 1200 Koban) If we want to look at the numbers: ~700 3 star girls in total and roughly 2-3/week fall in the top 7. 9 Mythic girls and generally 1-2/week falling in the top 7. If those are even close to accurate your Mythic girl is going to turn up (conservatively) one in 9 weeks. One of your 3 star girls is going to turn up around 12/233 (because they turn up - liberally- 3/week), so one in 20 weeks. Even if you half the Mythic appearance (because you're only getting half a Mythic), you're still likely coming out with a girl that will be more use to you than the 12 3 star girls, in terms of BDSM team. If you then account for the fact that you can get ~4 of those girls free, then the 1200 for the bonus PoA starts to look like a non-optimal investment. The differential here is that it's not a 3 star vs Mythic conversation. The bulk of the best girls for a team are 5 star rare/epic/legendary girls. Most weeks they seem to make up the bulk of the optimum girls. These girls are rarely available in Epic Pachniko (which is where the majority of the PoA rewards lie). This will change if KK continue to release Mythics and I strongly suspect that September will see a new Mythic. The more Mythic girls available the harder it will become to compete without a strong complement of Mythics. I'm not questioning those who have other drives than optimal performance in the league, 'getting them all' being one of the more common. But for league focused players, I really don't think the 'get more' strategy is likely to out perform patience and picking up the strongest girls possible. Quality over quantity is likely to gain you greater reward. Back on PoA - I'm seeing the same issue as you with optimisation of natural regen. It's ultimately likely to cost 100-200 Koban to complete the path due to the 200 combativity, but I'm probably willing to pay that.

So it is reasonable to assume then that you feel that using all rainbow is best for defense? Conversely, is it best to use all monos when attacking? Presumably matched to the opponents class?

I appreciate that there is no 'one comment fits everyone' statement about anything in the game. My point is a generalisation. If you've already got all the Mythic Pachinko girls these spheres are going to be (nearly) dead resources to you. [Burn them on Pachinko days to stock pile boosters] I would guess however, that while many of the top players are active in the forum for whom Mythic Pachinko isn't particularly useful, there are far more lurkers who aren't at that stage yet And that brings me back to where I started as the round-up above is likely totally irrelevant to those who have 700+ girls. Nor would a round-up targeted at these players be particularly useful as they've likely already done their own assessment. So yeah, you're right, but perhaps not my intended audience given your high level of advancement

I responded before reading all the posts, though someone else made the error I guessed you had so I left the post NB's interesting, but in a pool of 90 girls and a ~5% chance of drawing a girl, that's a massive number of spheres that you need to play through at Epic level to have a decent chance of getting her. You're really just left playing Epic Pachinko in the normal process of the game and waiting for the time you get lucky. If there are more in their that I haven't seen, this assessment might change slightly. Conversely, playing Mythic Pachinko, when a 5 star girl comes up if you have 300 spheres you have a very solid chance of getting here regardless of how many other girls you have in this rotation. This allows for targeted spending whenever a 5 star comes up. To my mind, that makes the 6 sphere Mythic Pachinko - where you can with 12 lock down all 3 girls for a known number of pulls - a significantly more powerful weapon for a young player than Epic Pachinko spheres, allowing them to spend a known amount of resources to get a girl that will improve their battle team.

Apologies - the section you quoted reads incorrectly. I did not mean 'I have not seen any 5 star Epic girls'. I have at least one. I meant 'I have not seen any 5 star girls in Epic Pachinko'. Conversely I've picked up 3 5 star Legendary girls in Mythic Pachinko this month. So, unless 5 star girls are in the pool in Epic Pachinko and I simply haven't seen them in there, I consider Mythic Pachinko spheres more valuable to me in terms of getting girls. The ability with Mythic Pachinko to pick and choose which girls you spend spheres getting is also a huge advantage. A couple of 5 stars in a pool of 90 to draw from in Epic doesn't make for good odds.

I've taken a quick look, and with natural refreshes and Seasons rewards (which I have the majority of intact) it should be close to possible to complete all 30 stages without spending Koban. I think there's a slight shortfall in terms of combativity, so maybe somewhere between 50-100 Koban.