Hour Change

[Peterminator]

Finally happen, all the cries from the European babys came to an end, the hour change is only a way to give more advantage to the Europeans and to discriminate to all the Latam and North America community. Why all the decisions that the devs make have to be high-handed? Don't you think that at least some topics have to be in consensus with the players' community? It's not fair that you choose an hour for us when you don't live here. How can I choose between make my preparations to go to work, even be on my way to my job, or attend the videogame? Don't you realize that with that kind of decisions you only make the gap even bigger between the communities of this game?

If the trouble was that the European can't attend the end of the events, why don't you choose an hour that fit to everyone like  9pm (UTC+1) that would be 3pm In Mexico and 5pm in Argentina? In that hour I think all we have the same chances to compete, or the change is only for subserve the European communty?

Finally, this is a call for all the Latam and North America community, we have to make our opinion count, I propose 9pm (UTC+1) as an alternative to the arbitrary hour the devs choose for everyone, but I think the best way is to do a poll to include everyone's opinion and if the devs doesn't want to hear us, we have to attack where it hurts to them: the wallet.

[GeorgeMTO]

This was mentioned in the previous week's patch notes. The reasons are below

Quote

Update hours change

• For technical reasons, starting next week the release hour will be moved to 13:00 UTC+1

1. This change will give us a faster reaction time for future updates and releases.
2. This will affect daily missions, arena daily quest, contests, leaderboard, and leagues

It's not related to the playerbase at all. It's them FINALLY realising that it's better for them to be in the office when the most problematic things occur. The time you have suggested fails to meet that purpose at all.

Does this change benefit Europe? Sure. Have they also chosen a time that's not unrealistically early for most of the NA/SA located players, while also not being too late for the residents of APAC that you seem to have not considered at all? Indeed they have. This is a global game, the time they choose HAS to be inconvenient for some region. Guess it's your turn.

[Slynia]

I mean, the reset time has been at 5.00 am for me since I started this game almost 3 years ago, that's a lot of lost contests thanks to other regions being awake.
Also like George here said, reset time is when the servers are the most vulnerable towards problems, so it only makes sense that the reset time would be during the devs' working hours at the very least.

[Dr. Lust]

The bottom line is the game, to my knowledge and I might be incorrect in this assumption, is available worldwide.  So no matter what time the devs choose there will be a group of people not happy.

The only thing they could do, and I realize this is most likely not economically feasible, is to have a separate device for each separate 8 hour section of the globe.  And that's probably not possible.  So, no matter what the devs and company do there will be a group of unhappy users.

The devs are caught between a rock and a hard place.  A true no-win situation.  A damned if you do and damned if you don't scenario.

Edited May 20, 2020 by Dr. Lust

[Antimon]

Il 20/5/2020 in 18:12 , Peterminator ha scritto:

Finally happen, all the cries from the European babys came to an end, the hour change is only a way to give more advantage to the Europeans and to discriminate to all the Latam and North America community. Why all the decisions that the devs make have to be high-handed? Don't you think that at least some topics have to be in consensus with the players' community? It's not fair that you choose an hour for us when you don't live here. How can I choose between make my preparations to go to work, even be on my way to my job, or attend the videogame? Don't you realize that with that kind of decisions you only make the gap even bigger between the communities of this game?

If the trouble was that the European can't attend the end of the events, why don't you choose an hour that fit to everyone like  9pm (UTC+1) that would be 3pm In Mexico and 5pm in Argentina? In that hour I think all we have the same chances to compete, or the change is only for subserve the European communty?

Finally, this is a call for all the Latam and North America community, we have to make our opinion count, I propose 9pm (UTC+1) as an alternative to the arbitrary hour the devs choose for everyone, but I think the best way is to do a poll to include everyone's opinion and if the devs doesn't want to hear us, we have to attack where it hurts to them: the wallet.

I love it how it is an intolerable injustice now that the reset hour falls for you in the morning when you are awake and you have to prepare to go to work, but before, when it was ok for your time schedule, it was perfectly fine and us europeans (for which the reset time was 5 am) were a bunch of crybabies. Adorable, indeed.

Unfortunately, as George said, it wasn't our trivial complaints that made them change the reset time

Edited May 24, 2020 by Antimon

[Peterminator]

hace 1 minuto, Antimon dijo:

I love it how it is an intolerable injustice now that the reset hour falls for you in the morning when you are awake and you have to prepare to go to work, but before when it was ok for your time schedule it was perfectly fine and us europeans (for which the reset time was 5 am) were a bunch of crybabies. Adorable, indeed.

Unfortunately, as George said, it wasn't our trivial complaints that made them change the reset time

I always said that the last schedule was unfair, but it was closer to a balance because the currency of every country, in special to that region (Europe),  could compensate that, I mean, you have more chances to not be a F2P user, while in most of Latam that's not a option, even some promos are exclusive for you, so don't you think it was a way to make things equal for everyone let the event with free kobans to the region where is most needed? If the problem is their office's schedule, OK, then tell us when you're working and decide on that basis, not fix something to do wrong in other areas without having a kind of poll. I don't count in my post to APAC because they almost are OK with any schedule, in the last one they had the one that in Europe is now, and with the new one, they have now the one America have until the update. Even so, having in mind that almost neither of the schedules let us to have a fair playground to everyone, I think @Dr. Lust gave the solution, having a reset time for every area and I add the notion that the Europeans should compete with the Europeans and the user from APAC while the Americans should compete between them, so no one has to be affected, tell me @GeorgeMTO, is that possible?

[Rysiek17]

25 minutes ago, Peterminator said:

If the problem is their office's schedule, OK, then tell us when you're working and decide on that basis, not fix something to do wrong in other areas without having a kind of poll. 

I don't think you realize that window they want to be their reset hour is smaller than you think. Let's say huge problem occur during reset. You think they will be able to fix it in few minutes? No. Sometimes they will need few hours and noone really wants to sit in office few overtime hours just to fix something, especially when they in theory could start doing it much earlier. 

Maybe they could change this hour a bit to be better worldwide, but your proposition is 8 hours difference. It's 1/3 of day. No way they would do that, and I already explained why.  

EDIT: Having few 'areas' sounds good on paper, but can be problematic as well. I think they would need to split community into whole different servers to do that smoothly enough. Depends how good their servers are though. It's for sure possible one way or another, but to be honest, I don't think it's gonna be their goal anytime soon. I don't know how many games with something like daily reset u were playing, but I've played a few and to be fair - I've never met few different hours of reset for one server.

Edited May 20, 2020 by Rysiek17

[Darsca]

21 minutes ago, Peterminator said:

Even so, having in mind that almost neither of the schedules let us to have a fair playground to everyone, I think @Dr. Lust gave the solution, having a reset time for every area and I add the notion that the Europeans should compete with the Europeans and the user from APAC while the Americans should compete between them, so no one has to be affected, tell me @GeorgeMTO, is that possible?

We (George and myself) cannot answer that question, as we don't work for Kinkoid. We are merely players that moderate the forum.

However, as for this 'proposed solution' of splitting the reset times, lets leave aside whether this is remotely feasible for a second. How does that solve anything? If something goes wrong on one of the resets when the techie Devs aren't in their office, then you've still got the same problem. 

To reiterate what George said, people need to get it out of their heads that this was a change to help/hinder any particular part of the playerbase. It's simply more convenient for Kinkoid; I've lost track of the number of times something new was broken at reset and we all had to sit and twiddle our thumbs while waiting for someone to wake up and fix it.

I don't think there is really anything more to discuss here, but I'll leave the thread open. However, preemptive warning to the thread in general; I'm already seeing some unpleasant back and forth between people in different time zones. If this gets toxic, I'm locking it up.

[natstar]

Only having one person complain about it shows that not many people care about the change so far lol.

[_shal_]

1 hour ago, Antimon said:

I love it how it is an intolerable injustice now that the reset hour falls for you in the morning when you are awake and you have to prepare to go to work, but before when it was ok for your time schedule it was perfectly fine and us europeans (for which the reset time was 5 am) were a bunch of crybabies. Adorable, indeed.

Self-awareness has never been the OP's strong point. As also evidenced by the completely unrealistic alternative reset time he has proposed.
 

22 minutes ago, natstar said:

Only having one person complain about it shows that not many people care about the change so far lol.

I suspect that's more because the people most likely to complain about it largely aren't the most attentive players, and it will take a bit longer for it to sink in that something has changed. Even this thread is arguably a week late already, given that Kinkoid provided advance notice.

Edited May 20, 2020 by _shal_

[pulli23]

The only "fair" thing they could do (but would be a massive nerf to all players gaining about 18% less resources) is to introduce 28-hour day, 6 day week in the game.

 

That way the reset "moves" forward 4 hours each day. At the same time if they do updates at the same time of the week it's always in a good hour. IE update day is monday, then reset is at noon UTC. Tuesday reset is at 16:00 UTC (and it's 15 o'clock in europe then, so still viable for minor fixes). Day after 20:00, then 24:00, 04:00, 08:00 and then it's monday already, we've "skipped" a full day.

[Peterminator]

OK, OK, I apologize for have pointed the finger over the European players, I won't  edit the main post just to leave the evidence that originates this apology. About what I propose, was only that, a suggestion thinking about an hour similar to the former reset in America now for the Europeans, nothing more, what I tried to said is that the hour is very problematic in the zones that I've mentioned, because of that we need to transfer the reset a couple of hours later, without affecting the working hours of any of the Kinkoid staff, I don't want that any of them work more than what are paid for.

Moreover, I don't want, or think, that any moderator solve this, but I think that any of you could take the complaint to the Kinkoid staff, could you do that @Darsca or @GeorgeMTO? I said this thinking that is well-known that the forum is not very taked in consideration by Kinkoid and affects a community that also is not very vocal because of the language, many times the people have complained or suggested something in Spanish only to see his efforts went to the trash can, I don't think that I'm the only one who has trouble with this change, but in Latam is not very common to have people who speak English.

[Dr. Lust]

There really is no good solution. 

If you have a single server that takes care of all the regions on the globe you have what we now have.  Some people irritated with reset time changes. 

If you split the resets up into multiple regions, then the only way to maintain it properly would be to have some people working 2nd and graveyard shifts monitoring the servers in case some thing went horribly wrong.  And they really can't ask anyone to do that.  That would be "over and above" the call of duty.  Too much to ask.   24/7 pager support for a game......too much to ask.   If it was a medical systems server, that would be one thing.  But for a GAME.  Not worth it.

Another solution would be to shatter the company into multiple offices around the globe to handle different time zones and that would be a logistical nightmare.

So.............the answer with the lowest negative impact would appear to be what they are doing.   Simply shifting the reset time.   What is the best reset time?  I shall let someone else solve that.  And being an ex-manager my heart goes out to whomever has that problem dropped on their desk.

 

[test_anon]

Hey… even for European, 13 o'clock is not perfect either, as some of us might be working… but hey at least we are now awake and do not have to wake up at 5 fucking o'clock that fucked my sleep schedule so many times.

 

Yeah, it could be hard for some people to be connected at this hours, but at least you are awake. You can connect during weekend or unworked days, so being competitive at least twice a week. Yeah, it's not perfect but this is a really huge improvement.

[xxx69]

I'm also a NA player that dislikes this change. That's at least 2 of us although forums never well represent the entire player community,

My suggestion would be to rotate the "start" time 8 hours every 4 months giving everyone a little bit of pain.

[DvDivXXX]

7 hours ago, Peterminator said:

Finally happen, all the cries from the European babys came to an end, the hour change is only a way to give more advantage to the Europeans and to discriminate to all the Latam and North America community.

This is such a gold mine of blatantly unfair and hilariously selfish whining... You've had a ridiculously huge advantage over Europeans for however long you've been playing the game, but sure, people who were not enthused about having to be awake at 5AM to stand a chance in daily competitions were "cry-babies"... Now that the tables are FINALLY turned (even though it's apparently just a lucky roll for the CET time zone, not even an attempt to restore some balance in the Force)... it's outright "discrimination" against NA players... Rrrright. Thanks for the laugh buddy. Looking forward to seeing how you like being the cry-baby, from now on. ^^

2 minutes ago, xxx69 said:

I'm also a NA player that dislikes this change. That's at least 2 of us although forums never well represent the entire player community,

My suggestion would be to rotate the "start" time 8 hours every 4 months giving everyone a little bit of pain. 

Astonishing. Do you know how many EU players disliked the previous status quo? A vast majority of them. Did anyone care, or make suggestions about complex rotating schedules that would never work even if Kinkoid had the technical capacities and willingness to put them in place? Not really, except for a few EU players, from time to time, who were completely ignored for years. Now it's your turn. And no, it does NOT make it any more necessary or relevant to make convoluted suggestions with unrealistic expectations. You've had a really, reeeeally long run with the most convenient reset time. Now it's our time to enjoy a less terrible one for a change. Good luck, have fun.

[Dr. Lust]

Looking around at the complaints from both sides of the pond.  One side in the past and another side now.  I am SO damn glad I do not have a competitive side in this retired person anymore.  Set the reset to whatever you like, Kinkoid.  In the meantime I'll just play my laid back relaxed game and eat my popcorn watching the hyper aggressive competitive people fight over the right to claim the most cartoons.

Unbelievable.............

[Zteev]

6 hours ago, pulli23 said:

The only "fair" thing they could do (but would be a massive nerf to all players gaining about 18% less resources) is to introduce 28-hour day, 6 day week in the game.

 

That way the reset "moves" forward 4 hours each day. At the same time if they do updates at the same time of the week it's always in a good hour. IE update day is monday, then reset is at noon UTC. Tuesday reset is at 16:00 UTC (and it's 15 o'clock in europe then, so still viable for minor fixes). Day after 20:00, then 24:00, 04:00, 08:00 and then it's monday already, we've "skipped" a full day.

I play in games where some things move every 23 or every 25 hours to spread the advantaged and disadvantaged times throughout the globe.It seems to work okay.

 

 

[GeorgeMTO]

7 hours ago, Peterminator said:

I don't count in my post to APAC because they almost are OK with any schedule, in the last one they had the one that in Europe is now, and with the new one, they have now the one America have until the update

I was more referring to THIS specific suggestion ignoring APAC

9 hours ago, Peterminator said:

choose an hour that fit to everyone like  9pm (UTC+1) that would be 3pm In Mexico and 5pm in Argentina?

That would be 4am in UTC+8 (China, Phillipines, Malasia, Indonesia, Singapore) and not much better in the surrounding countries. That's what I mean by you "ignoring" APAC, since that time is likely not okay for them.

 

Looking at all the various people suggesting multiple reset times or moving reset times, did you read the reasoning? It's so that Kinkoid can respond faster to issues at reset. If the reset time keeps moving to outside their office hours, that doesn't solve that issue. That's their priority there. And as Darsca said, it's been problematic numerous times, so I'm glad they're doing it.

 

1 hour ago, Dr. Lust said:

In the meantime I'll just play my laid back relaxed game and eat my popcorn watching the hyper aggressive competitive people fight over the right to claim the most cartoons.

Small aside (and definitely with my player hat on rather than the mod hat), would you mind doing that silently? No one has made more posts in this thread than you have. Either you're just as invested, or it's a cry for attention.

[nope1]

Anyway it broke tower of fame for me

[DvDivXXX]

11 minutes ago, nope1 said:

Anyway it broke tower of fame for me

Same here, I sent a support ticket. It seems that they forgot to move the time of the league token refills along with the rest, so we got 15/15 tokens at 5AM CET as before, but it's still the same league, so we can't seem to be able to use the tokens to actually attack (I get an error message when I try). They'll hopefully fix it by the actual reset time at 13:00 CET.

Edited May 21, 2020 by DvDivXXX

[ali-n]

13 minutes ago, nope1 said:

Anyway it broke tower of fame for me

Yeah, me too. What is interesting is that energy stays the same (15/15) no matter how many battles I do.

ADDED: unlike DvDivXXX, I do not get any error messages when I attack. 

Edited May 21, 2020 by ali-n

[darkhorse]

the tower of fame give me 15/15 as the old time but i do all the battles, and the time adjust is the worst update ever in the game

[Damoncord]

This is gonna play havoc with how I plan my play but I guess I'm gonna have to get used to it or not finish the daily missions during the mass events.  Sadly me playing on mobile isn't an option with my job.

[_shal_]

45 minutes ago, DvDivXXX said:

Same here, I sent a support ticket. It seems that they forgot to move the time of the league token refills along with the rest, so we got 15/15 tokens at 5AM CET as before, but it's still the same league, so we can't seem to be able to use the tokens to actually attack (I get an error message when I try). They'll hopefully fix it by the actual reset time at 13:00 CET.

Were you at 0/15 before 5am? I got that error message as well, but battling started working again when my next token came in as a natural regen. (And my display reverted back to 0/15 after the battle, i.e. it was really 1/15 before the battle.)