[ 07-Dec-20 ] Mythic Days - Discussion

[DvDivXXX]

1 hour ago, snowman22 said:

I really do not understand the "I should be able to get all content even if I am only a year into the game" crowd.

Could it have something to do with how little you understand this so-called crowd and what they actually advocate (at least the vast majority of them on this forum)? Anyone opening their argument by a laughably unfair mockery of what the other camp supposedly claims is there to preach, not to discuss. Please don't use intelligence-insulting straw men like this one in the future.

The rest of your post is solid in and of itself, and I'd even more or less agree with you if it actually addressed the arguments it claims to address, but it absolutely doesn't. It only addresses your straw man about imaginary noobs supposedly wanting everything easily and immediately. That's not a fan fiction I'm interested in reading, and it's so far removed from the debate you'd like to jump in that this arguably counts as off topic.

I'm only a year and a half into the game, and no, I don't want everything handed to me for free or without effort. And yes, I do get that veterans will automatically have a certain edge on me, just by virtue of having been around for many opportunities before my time, and having had a lot more time to progress in the game. That's not a problem in and of itself, and that's not what my main complaints are about, be it on this new event format or on the shockingly imbalanced PvP systems in this game. Not everyone sharing my perspective on those issues elaborates as much as I do, but I have yet to read any post that actually matches the greedy noobie stereotype your post "debunks" (which reminds me of a small but vocal group of D3 winners who really don't want their privileges noticed, let alone reduced).

Name me one other game worth its salt in which how well you perform in PvP matches is almost entirely determined by your account's playing time rather than, you know, how well you play the game. That's completely arbitrary and durably imbalanced, in favor of a small and specific group of players. That's not how games work, and that's not acceptable design (it's also extremely bad for the game economy, and thus bad for Kinkoid's profits, as the very portion of the player base they shower with free perks is the least likely to spend real money, or at least to need it). This new feature just reinforces this problem. So yeah, you'll see the "I should have a hope in hell at getting competitive in this game someday" crowd react. That's to be expected, and hopefully respected.

[snowman22]

1 hour ago, DvDivXXX said:

Could it have something to do with how little you understand this so-called crowd and what they actually advocate (at least the vast majority of them on this forum)? ...

Sorry if I came across as mocking, it was not my intent. We all started at L1.

I just am genuinely confused by posts about how expensive thing "X" is. (And posts about events being too short to get all the available girls without refills, or a drop rate being too low.) FWIW I looked at her and decided I would pass.

Overall I like the mythic girl change. I think they have priced her well. I think she is gettable by a large swath of players. I sort of wish I was a 300ish level player where getting her would be a real challenge and would pay back big time. I remember when Norou came out. I spent every horded koban to get her and 3 months of all my cash and affection items to get her to 5 stars. But then I kicked butt. Good times. (Now I do not use her )

We seem to agree that the PvP is simplistic and pretty broken. We also agree that there is a problem at the top of D2 and D3. I have just won D3 for only the second time ever so I suspect I am on cusp of being in your "small and specific group of players" but regardless, in past posts I have advocated nerfing D2 1st and D3 1-4 rewards.

The real tragedy here is how HC got screwed. First ever mythic dropped with zero warning? WTF! Right now every CH and KH player who can is piling up the kobans. Its going to be a bloodbath next month. I predict no left over shards.

So, no insult intended, just actual inability to see where people who complain about resource costs in general and the cost of the mythic in particular are coming from. We good?

[dd089966]

TL;DR:  I don't like the feeling being brought to the table with kinkoid trying to get blood from stone with the monthly mythics CROSSING OVER existing events.  Its too much and makes me want to quit even though I'm paying and successfully winning contests consistently.

So, mythic days coming every month may make me quit due to the high koban cost and if I can't get all the "free" girls while paying a minimum of $15 a month + winning 1st place on half of my contests I may as well just stop lol.  And that's the terrible thing, I LOVED mythic girls, but if they're going to be so "exclusive" that there's going to be a new one every month I may as well just let my membership expire and do something else with my life.

It sounds weird to say this, because I feel like its going to come across like I'm whining, but here's the thing.  I've been in a very perculiar spot to watch myself go from having lots of spare kobans when I began, to struggling a bit but maintaining easily enough because I paid and won lots of contests repeatedly.  To where now I'm still way more knowledgeable than before and win a teeny bit more yet have a super hard time maintaining kobans from all the events.

I have over 400 girls and its not like I'm hurting about that.  Its that I found myself looking at Amaya and thinking to myself what's the actual point of getting her?  And that's when I found myself going Oh.  Because I've never felt that way unless I spent like 8k-13k kobans trying to get an event pachinko girl.  But this is from kinkoid now. 

Btw the shard pool was really funny but tbh its a bad call because it just turns people off.  Pitting players against each other forcefully like feels bad and makes people decide not to do it and get that same feeling of "what's the point?" which leads people to yeet out.

edit: I'm in the almost 2 years crowd personally and I would post my ID but its not like you can look it up anymore because that feature was removed .-. hahaha, way to be inclusive.  btw my id is 1615963

Edited December 11, 2020 by dd089966
explained in edit

[DHarry]

On 12/10/2020 at 8:21 AM, Jan Red Dragon said:

What do you say ?? 

 I understand and 3000 more players is that we did not play because it was a very expensive event and we did not win enough, ... and that I pay for everything

I'm not sure what your question is if any, but I'm just pointing out that when KH comes, more people will think it's worth the price because A they had time to prepare and save and B it's KH and that can win leagues. 

The fact that there's shards left in the end when KK analyzes this will probably conclude they gave us too many. 

Therefore I expect there to be mayhem. Less shards, more people vying for them. 

[DvDivXXX]

4 hours ago, snowman22 said:

The real tragedy here is how HC got screwed. First ever mythic dropped with zero warning? WTF!

What HC players? I thought you were competing for top D3. ^^ No such unicorns up there...

8 hours ago, snowman22 said:

The real winners will be mid level players who scrape and sacrifice to get one and upgrade her. They will kill against their mythic-less peers.

4 hours ago, snowman22 said:

I sort of wish I was a 300ish level player where getting her would be a real challenge and would pay back big time.

You greatly overestimate the upside of such mandatory sacrifice for a mid-level player in the current state of the game. You even romanticize it in a way, as evidenced by your nostalgia of how things used to work back when you were a mid-level player. At the same time, you completely ignore the massive downsides of this addition for someone in this position now. The biggest one isn't the high cost in kobans and efforts, although it is an issue.

No, the main thing is that while I sweat blood and tears to grab and upgrade my one Mythic alpha for my class, most of the toughest opponents in my league will become much harder to snatch a few wins off of, and all of the serious contenders in the bracket I'm competing in (D3 top 30, for the record) will also obviously grab their own Mythic alpha, so apart from scoring more points on the fish we already all beat easily (which won't actually give me an edge, as all the other competitors will get the same boost) I fail to see what benefit this state of affairs would really grant me... I sure as hell will not be kicking ass let alone kill against my mythic-less peers as you so generously imagine. I will most likely struggle just as much, if not more than I've been doing for the past 4 months.

If you're referring to lower leagues, it's not that much brighter. Decent players at mid-levels in D2 are already struggling to keep their point totals exactly low enough to stay behind #16, while still ensuring their weekly Top 30 pittance. Having a Mythic alpha will only make this more of a challenge, if anything, while not giving them enough of a power level boost to reach higher goals (because of course the sharks routinely hijacking D2's Top 4 will still be there, and they will mythic up like every other end-game player out there, so within a few months they'll be just as untouchable as they already are, if not more, even if you have one measly Mythic yourself).

Anyways, this is more of a debate for the main MD thread, honestly. Nothing we're discussing is specific to this first event. And of course we good. Thanks for taking the time to consider things in different perspectives.

[Karyia]

On 12/10/2020 at 6:46 AM, GeorgeMTO said:

I think you've interpreted could differently from me.

This is true. I read "everyone" and it I guess it might've been "those".

 

On 12/10/2020 at 7:48 AM, Lemus said:

Now about the price and strength of the girl. Now, if there was a linear relationship, that would be a failure.

I agree. It doesn't have to. The price is higher than 3x though.

 

On 12/10/2020 at 7:48 AM, Lemus said:

Well, let's count how much you can save in two months. 150 * 60 = 9000 are daily rewards. 120 * 30 = 3600 let every second day you take 2-4 places in the contests. 300 * 8 = 2400 is a reward for 8 weeks in a tower that can be easily obtained from level 200+. 840 * 2 = 1680 two months in seasons. This will already be 16680. And there are still 9 days of the classic event and 5 days of the orgy event when they give additional gold. I'm too lazy to look for the total amount, but let it be about 50 per day, we get 50 * (9 + 5) * 2 = 1400. As a result, without really straining, it turns out 18k, which is most likely enough for a mythical girl, and if you try a little more or buy a little more for a donat, then it will be enough with a guarantee. So there is no need to tell fairy tales about the year of savings, it's only for those whose hands are growing out of their ass, but you are not like that, right?

This is actually my point. By your standards we should not "play" every two months just to try and get one girl on the third? And skip the other events during those months?

Let me put it differently... a 5-star legendary battleteam costs around 10 to 12.000 kobans (notice that the mythic girl is cost more than my entire battleteam), while a mythic one (apparently) costs somewhere between 40 to 48.000 (the variance gets bigger, of course). That's around 30.000 kobans difference and lots of sacrificed girls and events in between, right? Depending on how you play, you'll not get dozens of girls for these specific three. Doable? Sure! Fun and worthy, nope! (IMO, of course)

By your math alone, it doesn't seem that making it a monthly thing is good either but it might depend on how they roll it out from here on.

I would expect that a new layer of champions, with slightly higher stats, would be a more "natural" progression. Hell, make it a new realm without kobans or a different "coin", so it'll take time to go through it.

Bunna's stats are also pretty inline with the (former) top girls, so it's not impossible to see them "upgraded" in the future (who knows). I found that a bit strange.

 

Anyways, I guess we just have different views on worth, cost and so on. Like already said, hopefully they'll adjust it to something more manageable. Like already said, not adding much to anything so, let's see how it goes 👍

[MDuss]

On 12/7/2020 at 3:55 PM, darkone said:

 Does anyone already know the 6-star Bunna stats? It looks like the owners of this girl will finally kill the leagues.

 

Here you can see them.

https://harem-battle.club/wiki/Harem-Heroes/HH:Bunna

 

MfG
MDuss

[Lemus]

14 hours ago, Karyia said:

This is actually my point. By your standards we should not "play" every two months just to try and get one girl on the third? And skip the other events during those months?

Exactly. I don’t understand what surprises you in this? The concept of the game has always been exactly this - if you want to get all the content, then you have to donate to the game, and if you are not ready to do this, then you save up the donation currency that you receive for free for the gameplay and you yourself decide how to spend it. This is how I got the first 5 star legendary girl - for three months no spending of gold, but only accumulation. Then there was a burning ass when it was possible to get it only at the very end (there were no shards before, but there was a severe random, you could spend everything and generally be left with nothing). And then there were 2 months of savings to open all five stars. Actually, why should it be otherwise for the players now? Yes, lately the pendulum has swung strongly in the other direction, we were simply overwhelmed with gifts and resources, bonus codes for a bunch of gold are worth what, or here are the places of power from which tickets and orbs simply pour in, finally devaluing the usual money in the game, but for some reason I don't I see kilometer-long topics on the forum that would curse the developers for this - everyone likes everything, but it was worth introducing a super-expensive new girl for whom you need to save up for a long time, denying yourself other joys, so a howl immediately arose throughout the forum that this was robbery, deception and rip-off. The French have even called the theme something like "make a revolution." Well at least the guillotine is not yet offered to be pulled out of the museum and used for its intended purpose.)))

I will not say that I am completely delighted with the mythical days. For example, I really do not like that I have to "jerk off" the unfortunate bosses again by hammering the battle button hundreds of times knocking out fragments, and now I still have to do it at a certain time. "Annoying," as one anime character used to say. And the price, of course, is severe, no doubt about it. But with all the shortcomings, for me there is one advantage - this event does not change the global game concept of the project as a whole. As far as I remember, it was always necessary to torment bosses for the sake of girls, and there were also super-expensive girls for pvp. The concept of the game has not changed, but for some reason everyone was terribly excited by this and were surprised, like virgins in a brothel. I will not say that this concept is ideal, it is rather a compromise between the players and the creators of the game and it is unlikely that something will change here. Changing the global rules in the game is generally a difficult and dangerous thing. Why everyone was pissed off by the seasons - that they changed one of the deep rules of the game, that experience and girls can be obtained without donation. And when the seasons were changed to their current form, they agreed that it was not worth doing so, although, perhaps, they did not like it, but the "concept" was returned to its previous form. Now the players do not like the situation, but again, now, most likely, we will have to bend over and live with mythical girls at the cost of "two months of game abstinence". This is the way, this is the price.

In general, if you take a little aside, then changing the deep concepts of the project is a very difficult thing. You can crap so badly that a hundred assimilation machines won't rake it out later. There is one moderator bitten by bees running from topic to topic, screaming about justice and the concept that all players, regardless of their playing experience, have equal chances in pvp. And even I agree with him in many ways. But reality can be much more unpleasant than sweet fantasies. I suspect that in his wet dreams he sees how he, after the introduction of "equality", smashes Georgette in pvp and takes first places in the leagues. And the reality may be that there will be a lot of newcomers who have pumped 400+ in a month, from which already those who have been striving for this goal for two years will go nuts and already they will arrange a hysteria on the topic "I spent two years rubbing my time and money, and you all it was flushed down the toilet, damn you. " And then there will be massive departures of players and thousands of altos for fake pvp battles, I have already seen this in games where they tried to make "equality".

Oh, again I was "carried over the bumps". It's time to round up and go watch the new episode of The Mandalorian. Well, just in case I said too much again and set fire to the wrong butts, I love everyone, and you are all wonderful. Otherwise I would not have written all sorts of abstruse sheets of text here. Here's a gif with a bear and girls as a gift, and two more days off. Enjoy.)))

[Karyia]

59 minutes ago, Lemus said:

Exactly. I don’t understand what surprises you in this?

It's all good  

Even more so for the bear and the girls 👌 (I'm replying your whole post but won't put it all here because of the size).

I don't think I ever mentioned that we should be entitled to all content (it surely makes sense that there are options to get extra stuff and so on). What I was trying to say was a) the price/worth of the new girl was "over the moon" b) the form/manner of the new event was poor/bad. 

The only surprise to me was the "limited shard" thingy that turned it into sort of an auction. The rest seems normal gameplay to me (except the forced overpay of the x10 too but it goes with the territory, I guess). Part of those gifts seemed like sort of compensation for some of the changes, actually 😅

I think you might be "wrong" there (IMO). The concept of the game (collecting girls) is the same. The core gameplay has been changing with the last event types, for sure. PoA is a task manager (no shards, just tasks). LCs are shardless too, you compete and get 1/4, 1/2 or a full "block" of the girl (no shards, per say). MDs are even worse, there's no shards either, just "hits". The worse is that the "shards" (if you will) become available parts of the "pie", which serves as a limit to the players.

So, while the concept of the game is the same, I think the "core gameplay" has been changing (from combativity to PvP). And definitely, where we got the girls by ourselves before, now (I mean the newer events) it's always about PvP someway or another (which is absolutely an option of them to make, of course).

It's pretty natural and even unavoidable for the game to change or evolve somehow (or it would "die"), and for sure it must be hard/challenging to do it. It's probably impossible to satisfy everyone too. The game has become more intense (lots of events and without breaks) and (mostly) everything is becoming a competition. Some like it, others don't, like expected.

The introduction of a monthly event that is a short (48h) "limited auction" (shard thingy) with such high costs (over at least 12.000 kobans or so) that impacts the (poor) classic event that keeps getting shorter and shorter (let's face it, you're either on MDs or on classic, though (of course) you can invest even further and go for it all lol 🐻) added to all else (PoAs and LCs aren't exactly "breeze-through" events) is just a bit too much (in terms of generating enough to keep playing "regularly"), IMO. It's also "bad" that the "top girl" is not available to all (here I might be privileged because since I play, the top girls were always "available" on Champions).

Nothing against the introduction of the mythic girl itself, actually. I agree that there should be newer high/top-powered girls (and definitely new champions, just for the sake of introducing some more length there and new girls into the battle teams -> I'm supposing this is doable with stats and grades and such but I can't be sure).

In the end, I'm sure we agree in most things and just have a different view on other ones, which is pretty normal  

Take care, watch the girls, avoid the bear and keep playing 👍

 

[mates]

What a great use of this so expensive girl, must have been worth it... good job guys