The Foreplay - 14-19 January

[John 1039]

14 minutes ago, GeorgeMTO said:

Then why did they have so few as to only afford two refills?...

Yeah, sorry missed that. The player definitely could've used more accurate phrasing.

[John 1039]

@Mihai's estimates appear to be accurate enough. Commonly, it is going to be ~4,700 Kobans worth of combativity per drop.

Keeping activity in other events the same, going all-in for this new event type wouldn't be possible for any F2P player below at-least D2 in leagues, there too probably only at the top 4 positions.

Moreover, seeing as it is just ~700 Kobans below the 5400 threshold, I imagine a lot of players would feel spending hour(s) on starting each fight individually in order to save this comparatively small amount isn't worth it.

After the first initial months of playing, this would be the first event I'm strongly leaning towards not going all-in regarding boss event drops. This is almost equivalent to Pachinko attempts, with the addition of ymens and certainty of drops.

Strongly feels like the devs have created just another type of Pachinko.

For the type of players who stay away from Pachinkos, is this event worth it? Maybe only in the presence of specific highly wished drops, otherwise I don't believe so.

[Cantrix]

68 shards for 4 days farm+30 extra combativity from ToF. I'd say this evenet wasa waste of combativity. Even permanent boss girls have better shard drop rate. What a bull.

[Francois561]

I like that the devs are trying something new, but in the future I think this event could use a slight improvement. Here's my reasoning:

I can get an Epic Pachinko girl 100% of the time for 5400 kobans. If a limited-time event also has an Epic Pachinko girl on a villain, I expect to win her for less than 5400 kobans. (If not, I'm better off not participating in the event and playing epic pachinko instead.)

1 combativity point is worth 10.8 kobans. 5400/10.8 = 500 battles. The question is: can I win the girl in under 500 battles?

Given this event's parameters (0shards=90%, 1shard=2.5%, 2shards=2.5%, 3shards=2.5%, 4shards=2.5%), the probability of getting 100 shards in under 500 battles is 91.7%. That's good, but it's not great. One in 12 players participating in the event won't get their girl in 500 battles, and they'll feel cheated.

By contrast, during Epic Days (0shards=90%, 1shard=2%, 2shards=2%, 3shards=2%, 4shards=2%, 5shards=2%), the probability of getting 100 shards in under 500 battles is 99.1%. That's much better.

So my recommendation for future Foreplay events: increase the shard drops from 1-4 to 1-5. Or alternatively, don't include Epic Pachinko girls in it.

[Cantrix]

3 hours ago, trunks2585 said:

Okay skimmed over this thread so I might miss a few points, but here's my thoughts.

First I did get Lupa, had to spend maybe 1500 or so kobans, so not terrible.

That said, I do see the points of posters saying we should be able to obtain at least ONE girl koban free per event.  At least on revival events of this nature anyways.

On the other hand with this foreplay event and mythic pachinco, I do acknowledge the devs are working to correct one of the biggest issues with the shard system.  Having to wait a full year for the next attempt at a girl.  I see both sides of the argument here.

But I'm inclined to side with those saying shard drop rates or amounts could be higher.  I don't think it's silly to expect to be able to pick one girl out of a large group and be able to get one without having to spend kobans.  Get them all easy? No.  Never.  And maybe I'm spoiled by some other gacha games with good drop rates, but it's not uncommon to get something good out of most events on other gacha games.  Maybe not the top prize, whatever that might be, but SOMETHING.

I think every event honestly should have daily missions and a girl reward for doing all the missions.  Simplest solution to appease those that feel they are missing out.  Shards could stay as they are with the justification of 'you got the mission girl, if you get one of the other girls as well that's just icing on the cake'

That's my two cents on the issue.

On the part that at least one girl should be obtainable with free tries on an event, yes you are correct.
But presenting the Mythic pachinko as a solution to the shard system's drawbacks, i hope you are joking.

Fix of the shard system that requires you to cough up thousands of kobans to get a girl that you have almost fully acquired(let's say you have above75shards) and that's if she's the only one on rotation isn't a fix to the problem.
So to summarize it you are saying: "They intentionally made the game so grindy, so they can sell you an unreasonably expensive solution for the problem they created, and it is a great thing..." XD

[Cantrix]

On 1/16/2020 at 4:33 PM, Chthugha said:

And in not a single game you get everything for free. The companies behind the games need to make money. In fact, in most big games you won't get as much of the premium currency for free as in this one. So either you straight up buy the stuff in those games, or you have to make do with the basic useless shit everybody gets. It would be similar to getting an avatar in this game as reward for the event. In this game you can plan your premium currency usage. You get a lot and with thoughtful spending you are not going to be weaker than a paying player. It is not like you will be better off in the parts of the game where you can win kobans, when you pay, which makes f2p a rather meaningless term in this game.

Revival events are already catered to new players with high maximum shard drops so easy access to the villain girls. You have to realize that in a month with 4 events, they won't do that in every single event. And especially not with girls that are pachinko only girls during relatively recent events in the mix as well. It's high expectations based on common greediness (I want something for free in every event) that trigger what I call silly ideas on how to improve an event.

I have to disagree with you on this one. Ofcourse that we can't expect a freebie on each event when there are 4 events per month. But the number of events iper month sn't a player's idea, it's Kinkoid's. A girl was pretty much guaranteed(excluding the really bad luck scenarios and legendary days) with the old system.
And f2p games make most of their revenew not from premium currency transactions, but from selling convenience a.k.a monthly cards in this game.
Although Kinkoid are doing all of those at the same time as girls can be considered, a customization, an achievement and an advantage in the same time.
If you haven't watched "Let's go whaling", do give it a try it's quite informative for the state of current "free to play" games

 

Edited January 19, 2020 by Cantrix

[Observer_X]

50 minutes ago, Cantrix said:

68 shards for 4 days farm+30 extra combativity from ToF. I'd say this evenet wasa waste of combativity. Even permanent boss girls have better shard drop rate. What a bull.

Indeed, I am surprised to have reached 79/100 on Kaliko.

[LukeWarmbath]

56 minutes ago, Cantrix said:

68 shards for 4 days farm+30 extra combativity from ToF. I'd say this evenet wasa waste of combativity. Even permanent boss girls have better shard drop rate. What a bull.

Yeah I only reached 68 for Lupa.

[trunks2585]

45 minutes ago, Cantrix said:

On the part that at least one girl should be obtainable with free tries on an event, yes you are correct.
But presenting the Mythic pachinko as a solution to the shard system's drawbacks, i hope you are joking.

Fix of the shard system that requires you to cough up thousands of kobans to get a girl that you have almost fully acquired(let's say you have above75shards) and that's if she's the only one on rotation isn't a fix to the problem.
So to summarize it you are saying: "They intentionally made the game so grindy, so they can sell you an unreasonably expensive solution for the problem they created, and it is a great thing..." XD

Don't misunderstand me, I said they are working on a solution, I didn't say they had nailed it yet.  I'm well aware of the issues with the proposed idea of spending thousands of kobans on a girl just to gain a few shards that you might be missing, and that's if you get lucky and she's on rotation and you don't have anyone else besides her to get (which I've had that happen to me a number of times now, but still not gonna spend the kobans for that.)  This current event  would be a better solution if the drop rates or amounts were better, but it still needs work.  However, as we've seen, the devs are reluctant at best to make changes to a system that is already live.  Even when they test something they are almost already set in their ways and only after they see it failing to work do they change it.

The next step in their solution I guess are these pachinko ball things which I suppose will function as free draw tickets, but if they are for single pulls or x10 guarantee pulls, who knows.  We'll have to see how it goes and if they make doing events any easier.  Hell giving out a x10 epic pachinko pull ticket as a reward for doing all the event missions would actually be a good solution to the 'garenteed girl' idea.  You could only use it in EP but it would get you a girl and help drain the pool a little faster, meanwhile you couldn't just save the reward if it was a koban payout and use it for something else, so the devs still get control over how you use your reward.

Anyway that's just my idea and beside the point.  I'm by no means saying mythic pachinko is perfect as is.

[Karyia]

3 hours ago, GeorgeMTO said:

I'm confused. Did you use all your kobans or did you save all your kobans? I really can't tell.

I actually think he is talking about combativity... started with the max 20 he saved and then used all he got available + did 2 refills.

I think that would match what he says, though he is calling it the wrong name.

[DvDivXXX]

5 hours ago, Dr. Lust said:

I agree with the general thoughts of the players here.   One "free" girl for us free to play players would be quite generous and appreciated by all the f2p players. myself included.  Also, what would be very nice would be a SMALL chance at the pay to play/koban players girls.  Not sure how that would be done and done fairly.

There already IS. It's called the x100 drop, and while it's rare (thankfully) it does happen. Also the occasional x100 drop on the free Mythic Pachinko spin. There's a dedicated thread for each of these, and you can see plenty of players post such results fairly regularly (and for sure many players have such drops as well but don't post here).

Also, even though I perfectly understand and even respect your clear stance that you want to be strictly casual and not "work" to become good at the game, please don't turn into one of the regular posters who also do that (but usually don't admit it as openly as you) but then post nonsense all the time because they didn't do their homework, so they have completely false assumptions and expectations, but they speak as if they knew what they're talking about. You really can't speak for "all F2P players", for one thing, but most importantly, although I already explained it multiple times and in details, kindly note that there are no "pay to play/koban players girls". This not a P2W game. You can do very well as a F2P, if you work for it, which is F2P as it should be. Just because you don't want to go that route, doesn't make anything in this game P2W.

4 hours ago, John 1039 said:

Commonly, it is going to be ~4,700 Kobans worth of combativity per drop. (....) Strongly feels like the devs have created just another type of Pachinko.

Rrrrrrrrright. Forget about the free combativity during the event, the ability to choose which specific girl(s) to go for (or not), and the expected average results. I got only one girl this event, by choice, but it only costed me 10 refills (a little bit over 2000 kobans), and that was a formerly Event Pachinko exclusive girl. And I was under the curve in terms of free drops...

2 hours ago, Observer_X said:

Indeed, I am surprised to have reached 79/100 on Kaliko.

2 hours ago, lol69 said:

Yeah I only reached 68 for Lupa.

I know, right? What unlucky poor F2P players you guys are... Meanwhile, I got a grand total of 51% from my free fights throughout the event, and I had to use this CORE GAME MECHANIC that you bad players love to demonize so much: spending the IN-GAME CURRENCY to finish the girl. What a P2W spoiled cheater that makes me! It's so unfair to you guys. Cry me a bloody river. Maybe learn to play, get good, stuff like that? I dunno. Or just whine and don't learn. If you're having fun this way, whatever floats your boat. ^^

 

 

[Karyia]

I think part of the problem resides in the fact that this, seems to me, is more like a "limited collector" event.

I might be wrong (I'm away and can't currently confirm, so bear with me please) but it seems the girls available were exclusive and are now being made available? If so, it makes sense that they are "harder" to get. I'm also assuming that they will return later, though that is not a given (I think).

If I'm not mistaken, this event is also happening instead of a revival event (or at least usually it is, I think) and the announcement, IMO, doesn't help (enough?) making it clear the distinctions between them.

This leads to frustration since the expectations might be wrong from the get go.

Personally, I can't complain since I got a 100-drop on the girl I wanted the most (lucky me, I know).

I also lean to the automatic "get-a-girl-every-event" argument but it's not the end of the world if a few/several, specific and "special" events, don't. In those, I only expect that there is a shot/chance at, at least, getting one, and that's where the koban usage gets more into it. That, to me, would be great and, I think, expected. It's a matter of getting a balance for this, though it might be hard to satisfy both "rookies" and veterans.

Having said all that, I can certainly understand the frustration of some players. It's hard, in cases, to grind and grind and grind and have nothing to show for it. Not sure if a shard rate adjustment would help but I suppose so. Several ideas have already been mentioned, so I suppose that we can look at this event as a "test trial" (it was a first) and hope that they will make adjustments in order to make it even better.

I think I might be getting the Zorba or DvDivXXX effect, sorry for that 🙄😂

Anyway, just a thought (or two).

[John 1039]

2 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

Rrrrrrrrright. Forget about ... the ability to choose which specific girl(s) to go for (or not), and the expected average results...

If only I had stated something like "almost equivalent to Pachinko attempts, with the addition of ymens and certainty of drops ... [worth it m]aybe only in the presence of specific highly wished drops".

Apologies, but didn't understand the "expected average results" part; the 4.7K amount presently appears to be the expected average.

2 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

... free combativity during the event... I got only one girl this event, by choice, but it only costed me 10 refills (a little bit over 2000 kobans), and that was a formerly Event Pachinko exclusive girl.

Refraining from condescension, I think you are mistakenly overlooking the fact that this event is a replacement for a normal revival event.

Last year, in the first 5-day event of the month, six times for the second revival of events - Spring Break (2), Easter (1), Music Party (1), Summer Life (0, but that almost certainly was a mistake), S Journey (1), Back to School (1) - six times a previously Pachinko-only drop was included on a boss. A small caveat here, the timing (whether it be the first 5-day or the second 5-day) changed in October with the introduction of Or days. While, technically, it is possible that Kinkoid will do the shuffle in the second 5-day event of this month, however, it is quite unlikely since the present pattern appears to be making sure that at least the last year's classical event gets one normal revival.

Therefore, even for one-year veterans, if the goal was one previously-Pachinko-only drop, keeping in mind the loss of thousands of Kobans, mission-Kobans and legendary gifts, this event was quite unfavorable. I'm not saying this completely refutes the new event-type, just pointing out that your apparent disregard of this fact appears to represent a certain strong bias on your part.

And as for less-than-one-year players (as I'm sure you're well aware of at least one such individual) they could've almost certainly managed to get two drops with "free combativity during the event" plus (usually) at-most half the Kobans that you used, and possibly even a net Koban gain.

If I'm not very mistaken the fact is, that previously a first-year player could've managed two drops (one of them likely to be a previously-Pachinko-only) for just ~300 Kobans net loss, in addition to an epic equipment set and chance for legendary gifts; and now they can get only a single drop for ~1,800 Kobans (avg.). Tell me, should a first-year (mostly F2P) player, from their point-of-view, be proud of defending such a change?

Regarding being a "type of Pachinko", I was primarily focusing on the amount of Kobans needed with-respect-to the 5400 "anchor" (credit to Cantrix for that term) amount. In the present setting, the ~4,700 amount is only near to the Pachinko anchor. Though notedly, it is almost equivalent to the second 5-star-legendary during Legendary days, however, their significantly different stats puts them out of this context. Every other single, event boss-drop costs at maximum ~3.5K (on average), therefore, ~4.7K is objectively closer to the Pachinko amount.

The other reasons I considered this Pachinko-similar was the presence of event Pachinko-only-drops (partly a positive change), and that it appears to be directed towards the players who don't touch Pachinko, in order to get them to spend their hoarded Kobans (and hopefully pay for more). These aren't necessarily unqualified negative things.

4 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

You really can't speak for "all F2P players", for one thing...

So, are you contending that as @Dr. Lust mentioned, you wouldn't consider one free drop "quite generous and appreciate" it? Which F2P player would dislike a "free" drop?

2 hours ago, Karyia said:

Several ideas have already been mentioned, so I suppose that we can look at this event as a "test trial" (it was a first) and hope that they will make adjustments in order to make it even better.

Clearly sounds like you're very new here. If past dev actions, or rather inactions, are anything to go by, definitely don't expect a change.

[DvDivXXX]

1 hour ago, John 1039 said:

I think you are mistakenly overlooking the fact that this event is a replacement for a normal revival event. (...) Tell me, should a first-year (mostly F2P) player, from their point-of-view, be proud of defending such a change?

You probably either didn't read or forgot about my earlier posts in this very thread in which I stated loud and clear that I consider this Foreplay event subpar and not worth spending much on, especially compared to something very profitable like a revival event. It's just not THAT bad either, and I feel many posters went way too far in their complaints about it, definitely including the post of yours I was replying to.

2K-ish kobans for one Event Pachinko exclusive girl isn't that bad, all things considered. Do I think it would have been worth it to spend twice as much (because no more free combativity for them) to get more girls? No, and that's why I stopped there. But it wasn't a completely useless or terrible event either. Comparing it to a Pachinko disguised as an event, or comparing it to a great value event like a revival simply because it happens to take place in a spot where we usually get a revival is just nonsensical.

I also strongly doubt that this event "replaced" a normal revival event. It took place at a time of the month where we usually get a normal revival event, yes, but that's about timing, not content. And yes, I'm pretty sure we can expect Orgy Days 3 at the end of the month. They're not just going to skip one revival altogether this month, I don't think. So I judge this event on its own merits, even though they are very limited in my opinion and in my situation. So there is no "change" as you boldly claim here. It's not about being proud of defending anything, it's about calling a spade a spade.

1 hour ago, John 1039 said:

Which F2P player would dislike a "free" drop?

No one, because free stuff is free, right? Yeah, I for one wouldn't be too pleased if they actually did that, to be honest. It would be super generous, for sure, but I wouldn't appreciate it. I think they're generous enough as it is, and since we basically have an ongoing event at any given time, except for about 4 days "off" per month, I find it frankly ridiculous to expect every last event to give you a free girl without even having to spend a bit of your hard-earned free kobans on it.

But beyond that, I was mostly saying to Dr Lust that he shouldn't speak for all F2P players because he's not really representative of them. He's pretty representative of hard casuals, though, so he can speak for those, I guess. More free stuff, less strategy, kthx QQ. Sure.

Not every event is meant for everyone (they might need to find another name for it, if many players keep this trend of pretending it's supposed to mean "an event" as in "a rare opportunity" as it is in most other games, honestly). A big part of playing this game (in any meaningful capacity) involves thinking about that, and taking decisions. If every event gave everyone one girl for free without any effort no matter what, then it would undermine the huge differences between different event types. I'm with Chthugha on that: I'm pretty sure if they did that, we would very soon start seeing new waves of QQ based on how hard it is to get the second, and the third girl, in this or that particular event. QQ coming from players who don't check drop ranges, don't make any calculations, don't save kobans for specific goals, and so on.

Good plays should be rewarded. Bad plays should not. Free stuff is fine and dandy, but we already get well enough overall in this game compared to most others with a similar monetization system. That's my opinion, at least. And I'm done trying to change others' opinions on this or anything else, honestly. We need every type of players, from the super casual whale all the way to the super good F2P player, and everything in between. So enjoy whatever you enjoy, and think whatever you think, people. 😙

Edited January 19, 2020 by DvDivXXX
French saying replaced by English one

[LukeWarmbath]

6 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

 

I know, right? What unlucky poor F2P players you guys are... Meanwhile, I got a grand total of 51% from my free fights throughout the event, and I had to use this CORE GAME MECHANIC that you bad players love to demonize so much: spending the IN-GAME CURRENCY to finish the girl. What a P2W spoiled cheater that makes me! It's so unfair to you guys. Cry me a bloody river. Maybe learn to play, get good, stuff like that? I dunno. Or just whine and don't learn. If you're having fun this way, whatever floats your boat. ^^

My only gripe was that I went nearly 90 combat tries over a 2 day period without a single shard drop. *shoulder shrug*

And I spent my kobans on the 5400 epic pachinko on the second day of the event, which I wasn't going to spend on combativity anyways, especially with my shard drops stalling out like they did... And unfortunately I was absent that day from school they taught future telling, so I had no way of knowing if I'd need kobans to finish a girl or not. 😂

Quote

 

 

 

Edited January 19, 2020 by lol69

[DvDivXXX]

12 minutes ago, lol69 said:

My only gripe was that I went nearly 90 combat tries over a 2 day period without a single shard drop. *shoulder shrug*

No problem. You do you. Not everyone who plays with odds needs to understand this (and most players of games that involve odds do not):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variance

Superstition is more widespread among players of games of chance, and we need storytelling in our lives anyway.

Edited January 19, 2020 by DvDivXXX

[LukeWarmbath]

4 minutes ago, DvDivXXX said:

No problem. You do you. Not everyone who plays with odds needs to understand this (and most players of games that involve odds do not): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variance

Superstition is more widespread among players of games of chance, and we need storytelling in our lives anyway.

2 much math4me. Nearly had just had a brain aneurysm

[John 1039]

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

You probably either didn't read or forgot about my earlier posts ... Foreplay event subpar and not worth spending much on...

You're right, I apologize, I forgot what you wrote. It was nearly four days ago.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

... and I feel many posters went way too far in their complaints about it, definitely including the post of yours I was replying to.

The only things you mentioned to counter my "complaint" were:

• "the free combativity" - which undeniably is more efficiently used in literally all event-types, aside from the Legendary days, and arguably there too;
• "the ability to choose" - which I already noted in my first post;
• "and the expected average results" - whatever that's supposed to mean.

Furthermore, you haven't replied to the fact of 4.7K being significantly higher than ~all other Koban requirements per drop outside of the Pachinko. So, what exactly was the point that you believe I "definitely" "went way too far in"?

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

2K-ish kobans for one Event Pachinko exclusive girl isn't that bad, all things considered.

It kind of literally is. One Event Pachinko exclusive for 2K-ish kobans is objectively bad when the previous iteration resulted in one for free. What am I missing here? And if by "all things considered", you mean choosing the only drop that one desires, I already mentioned that nuance and moreover it becomes too subjective to make general objective statements about.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

But it wasn't a completely useless or terrible event either.

Strawman. Did I say that?

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

Comparing it to a Pachinko disguised as an event...

"Pachinko disguised as an event". Again strawman, I didn't state anything so unnuanced. I've already stated what I meant by "another type of Pachinko"; if it wasn't clear in the first post, I apologize. It should've become evident by the second.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

... comparing it to a great value event like a revival simply because it happens to take place in a spot where we usually get a revival is just nonsensical.

I think it's pretty standard to compare an event with the one it replaces. Isn't it?

Using your standard I believe Kinkoid can argue that "comparing [3rd Anniversary] to a great value event like [the 2nd Anniversary] simply because it happens to take place in a spot where we usually get [the 2nd Anniversary] is just nonsensical." The "usually" part is a bit stretched, but the fallacy should be obvious. Most veteran players would be able to say how negatively they'd feel about such an argument. Furthermore, I didn't just compare because of the timing, the efficiency of free-combativity per drop and value for both less and more-than-one-year old players was also noted.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

I also strongly doubt that this event "replaced" a normal revival event. It took place at a time of the month where we usually get a normal revival event, yes, but that's about timing, not content. And yes, I'm pretty sure we can expect Orgy Days 3 at the end of the month. They're not just going to skip one revival altogether this month, I don't think. So I judge this event on its own merits, even though they are very limited in my opinion and in my situation.

If a second new thing takes the place of the first old thing, I believe this is called a replacement. Apparently, you're now equating the term "Or days" with "normal revival events", in which case you're going to confuse a lot of people. The two different terms are used to differentiate the two different event-types. The Or days event existed already, in this context, it isn't some new compensation for the replacement of a normal revival event. In each two months with Or day, there was a classic event, normal revival event, Epic days, then Or days. Therefore, regardless of whether there is an Or days this month or not, but especially if there is, if the "normal revival event" gets removed and the "For event" is introduced in its place, what else is it, if not a replacement?

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

So there is no "change" as you boldly claim here.

Even aside from the nitpicks, I'm interested to see how you can defend the blatant "no 'change'" claim. The only way this would be a nearly no change is, if the next Or days includes the drops from three instead of two past events, includes Legendary gifts, gives additional event-Kobans and event equipment-set not received this event, and most importantly, five days worth + 20 of free combativity (ignoring the Leagues' rewards), that's worth ~3K Kobans. Are you saying this is what you expect?

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

It's not about being proud of defending anything...

I do apologize for not remembering your earlier post, however, still, you stated: "but it only costed me 10 refills (a little bit over 2000 kobans), and that was a formerly Event Pachinko exclusive girl. And I was under the curve in terms of free drops... [emphasis added]". I apologize if I'm mistaken, but it did appear you felt good by your achievement.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

... it's about calling a spade a spade.

More like calling a strawman.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

No one, because free stuff is free, right?

Are you being sarcastic here or are you agreeing that Dr. Lust's statement about everyone appreciating a "free" drop is accurate?

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

Yeah, I for one wouldn't be too pleased if they actually did that, to be honest. It would be super generous, for sure, but I wouldn't appreciate it. I think they're generous enough as it is, and since we basically have an ongoing event at any given time, except for about 4 days "off" per month, I find it frankly ridiculous to expect every last event to give you a free girl without even having to spend a bit of your hard-earned free kobans on it. ... we already get well enough overall in this game compared to most others with a similar monetization system.

Expectations are pretty subjective so can't hold a firm position and talk much, I would just point out the video shared by Cantrix above. The devs created an anchor, probably a little arbitrarily; if a comparison with such anchors suggests the devs are being too generous, it doesn't necessarily mean they actually are.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

But beyond that, I was mostly saying to Dr Lust that he shouldn't speak for all F2P players because he's not really representative of them. He's pretty representative of hard casuals, though, so he can speak for those, I guess. More free stuff, less strategy, kthx QQ. Sure. ... A big part of playing this game (in any meaningful capacity) involves thinking about that, and taking decisions. If every event gave everyone one girl for free without any effort no matter what, then it would undermine the huge differences between different event types. ... Good plays should be rewarded. Bad plays should not.

While designing a game such as this, one way to differentiate between casuals and actives is to stop the progress of casuals (progress here meaning one complete drop and not partial shards), and let actives proceed; the other way is to allow small progression for casuals (one drop) and significantly higher progression (three drops) for the actives. It appears that you would prefer the more negative approach/threshold.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

Not every event is meant for everyone...

I'd say most players accept that to a fair extent, begrudgingly as it may be. For instance, in Legendary days, with the exception of some (primarily just the one), players acknowledge that they cannot get a 5-star legendary drop for free. Similarly but on a smaller scale is the case for Epic days. However, this doesn't mean that everyone should be expected to silently accept a third even more significantly expensive event.

3 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

I'm with Chthugha on that: I'm pretty sure if they did that, we would very soon start seeing new waves of QQ based on how hard it is to get the second, and the third girl, in this or that particular event. QQ coming from players who don't check drop ranges, don't make any calculations, don't save kobans for specific goals, and so on.

Isn't this by definition the slippery slope fallacy? Furthermore, are you saying that just because you don't want to see casuals making more illegitimate complaints on the forum, you would rather even have your own game-progress restricted?

[blaa]

26 minutes ago, John 1039 said:

It kind of literally is. One Event Pachinko exclusive for 2K-ish kobans is objectively bad when the previous iteration resulted in one for free. What am I missing here? And if by "all things considered", you mean choosing the only drop that one desires, I already mentioned that nuance and moreover it becomes too subjective to make general objective statements about.

What you are missing here is that the "usual" revival in this place (which would have been a first revival) wouldnt have had a event pachinko girl, so there wouldnt have been any chance to get one of them. Thanks to this event I got the chance for 5(!) of them for just a few kobans (which I will most likely have gatherd in 2-4 weeks playing), the alternativ would have been "not a chance for any girl", at least for me.

In general (and short), there is not something like a good or bad event, it's just a good or bad event for me or for you. There is no objective rule for judging this event, just individual orientations. Like you pointed out, it's just subjective. With this in mind, I would argue, let's enjoy our harems (or for whatever reasons you play)

Edited January 19, 2020 by blaa

[snowman22]

Bucking the trend with a short, positive summary.

I did well in the event. Spent about 11K kobans in addition to the free fights and got 3 event girls, plus Dark Lord's level 2 girl, plus 33 shards on his level 3 girl, plus enough affection from Karole to give them all a star or two, plus raised DL's cash payout to the point where it is not laughable.

Those who are in the "every event should give me a girl" camp. Think what you are saying. That was never the intent. The whole point of a "game" is you can not get everything. Pick your shots. Sacrifice here, make out like a bandit there. Play the game. The game already gives out lots for free.

[John 1039]

Did you really go through the pain and trouble of reading all of that?

21 minutes ago, blaa said:

What you are missing here is that the "usual" revival in this place...

I noted this in my previous reply:

6 hours ago, John 1039 said:

Last year, in the first 5-day event of the month, six times for the second revival of events - Spring Break (2), Easter (1), Music Party (1), Summer Life (0, but that almost certainly was a mistake), S Journey (1), Back to School (1) - six times a previously Pachinko-only drop was included on a boss. A small caveat here, the timing (whether it be the first 5-day or the second 5-day) changed in October with the introduction of Or days. While, technically, it is possible that Kinkoid will do the shuffle in the second 5-day event of this month, however, it is quite unlikely since the present pattern appears to be making sure that at least the last year's classical event gets one normal revival. 

If the next 5-days is a normal revival and Kinkoid does shuffle, then you would be correct. I was primarily replying to the other user and since they didn't argue against this assumption, I went with it.

23 minutes ago, blaa said:

Thanks to this event I got the chance for 5(!) of them for just a few kobans (which I will most likely have gatherd in 2-4 weeks playing)...

Yes, good for you, but I'm pretty sure that you already know that you don't represent the vast majority of the player base. Furthermore, I already noted this also:

15 hours ago, John 1039 said:

Keeping activity in other events the same, going all-in for this new event type wouldn't be possible for any F2P player below at-least D2 in leagues, there too probably only at the top 4 positions.

Moreover, seeing as it is just ~700 Kobans below the 5400 threshold, I imagine a lot of players would feel spending hour(s) on starting each fight individually in order to save this comparatively small amount isn't worth it.

And lastly,

31 minutes ago, blaa said:

In general (and short), there is not something like a good or bad event, it's just a good or bad event for me or for you.

Yes, exactly, though I suppose events such as the 3rd anniversary can be objectively judged. I generally mean the same thing, I thought I was careful enough to describe the specific subset of players I was referring to, but I apologize if I wasn't clear enough.

[Chthugha]

10 minutes ago, John 1039 said:

Did you really go through the pain and trouble of reading all of that?

I noted this in my previous reply:

If the next 5-days is a normal revival and Kinkoid does shuffle, then you would be correct. I was primarily replying to the other user and since they didn't argue against this assumption, I went with it.

Yes, good for you, but I'm pretty sure that you already know that you don't represent the vast majority of the player base. Furthermore, I already noted this also:

And lastly,

Yes, exactly, though I suppose events such as the 3rd anniversary can be objectively judged. I generally mean the same thing, I thought I was careful enough to describe the specific subset of players I was referring to, but I apologize if I wasn't clear enough.

Not really. That event had girls on the villains that new players might not have had gotten yet. So they might think it was great. Especially with Norou dropping shards in the arena. There is always a perspective.

[John 1039]

Yes, you're right, I wasn't thinking too seriously on this. For the moment, I might be just slightly relieved that this was the only part you wrote your objection against.

[DvDivXXX]

2 hours ago, John 1039 said:

[Tons and TONS of nitpicking. Impressive, really. ^^]

Look, I'm sorry you went through all this trouble in reply to my post, but I'm not going to do the same. For once, I wasn't focusing on every last detail, as you clearly assumed and as you definitely did yourself when you retaliated. My main points were that this is a subpar event format in my book, and this first edition wasn't exciting by any means, but not outright terrible either. I got a girl for 2K kobans that would have costed 5.4K in Pachinko otherwise, which yeah, I'm okay with (just like snowman, I also got side benefits in the process: got Akhates, started Dark Lord's Tier 3 and got a few shards for Esperance already).

I'm not going to argue on semantics, or even on details, certainly not as vehemently as you'd probably like me to, sorry. If you want to call this new event type a replacement of a revival because they have slotted it where we usually have a regular revival, be my guest. I think the fact that we're very likely going to get an Orgy Days this month instead of two regular revivals more than makes up for it, because one Orgy Days event is much, much better than two regular revivals combined in my book. And since there were only two old events to "revive" this month, we wouldn't have had an Orgy Days without this new Foreplay thing taking up a spot so that both regular revivals turn into one OD. You disagree, that's cool, agree to disagree.

Allow me to quote myself, here. First, the only part of my previous long post you didn't quote, but which was actually a really serious message, and then a pretty similar statement I made in another thread in which I was venting my frustration and coming to the same conclusion.

6 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

That's my opinion, at least. And I'm done trying to change others' opinions on this or anything else, honestly. We need every type of players, from the super casual whale all the way to the super good F2P player, and everything in between. So enjoy whatever you enjoy, and think whatever you think, people. 😙

7 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

I decided to cut way back on advising or criticizing others in this game from now on. It hurts me more than it does them. I'm just a bit frustrated after reading so many things that make me roll my eyes. I'll focus more on my own case, and try to share my opinion on the game itself rather than commenting others' opinions I disagree with.

Cheers, good luck, have fun. ^^

[DvDivXXX]

On 1/19/2020 at 10:36 PM, DvDivXXX said:

I think the fact that we're very likely going to get an Orgy Days this month instead of two regular revivals more than makes up for it, because one Orgy Days event is much, much better than two regular revivals combined in my book. And since there were only two old events to "revive" this month, we wouldn't have had an Orgy Days without this new Foreplay thing taking up a spot so that both regular revivals turn into one OD.

Hey! Good call, there. 😃 Look what event we're getting in a few hours... Orgy Days!