[ 20-Jul-22 ] Golden Anniversary - Discussion

[Mr.S]

This is a shit show is what everyone is politely trying to say.

Any word from Kinkoid yet?

[bolitho76]

Before Reset time some of them was active on Discord. After the Reset... nothing from them until now. Oh, I forgot: Tohru posted some hours ago the new calender with Bunna and an announced KC for tomorrow:

[Ryu_D_sama]

9 minutes ago, DvDivXXX said:

Actually, it's even worse than that. Some F2P or small budget long-time veterans may have massive stockpiles of in-game resources, but that doesn't include real-life money. So no, it doesn't cater to them at all. At most, they can get half the MAIN rewards, for almost 6k in kobans.

As for P2W players, the bar seems to be set too high even for most of them. I mean €50 in real-life money (plus the same 6k kobans) isn't even close to letting them get all four MAIN rewards of the event. This seems punishing for everyone but the biggest real-money spenders, aka the whales, which normally don't need such incentives, and certainly don't represent a big enough part of the player base (or even the game's income, for that matter) to justify putting out a massive month-long super hyped "Anniversary" special event basically just for them...

The only sane explanation is they screwed up the maths something fierce. Fingers crossed we'll have a response by tomorrow.

You would think with this high a cost to complete, there would be a Mythical included.

Lets hope changes are made quick, and perhaps a gift code to compensate anyone deterred day 1.

[bolitho76]

If they decrease the requirement to 1/2 they had nothing more to do. 9.000 crystals is able to reach for most actice Veterans and with not a to great investment also for middle level player. Whales can get the girls fast and they are happy, normal player can use the whole time to minimize the needed spending on top.

[DvDivXXX]

Yeah, honestly I haven't dared opening Discord since this launch yet. I'll do so eventually, I'm curious to see what CMs and fellow mods in particular had to say. But I'm anticipating a pretty big shitstorm there. As someone else said, we forum regulars are fairly... moderate in expressing our frustration compared to the larger part of the community active on Discord. I feel for Discord mods right now.

[Incubys]

KK isn't a charity and is out to make money, period. Mythics are (possibly were as they start to reach saturation point) a good cash cow. KK see this as a new way to make money. I suspect that if they do not re-balance this event soon they will see how badly they have mis-judged things as I would guess very few players are able / willing to invest the amount of money required to complete in the event. Which means if they don't change it now, it will either be shelved as a bad idea or re-worked before being wheeled out for Christmas.

[Gartalgar]

il y a 8 minutes, bolitho76 a dit :

Oh, I forgot: Tohru posted some hours ago the new calender with Bunna and an announced KC for tomorrow:

Maybe Bunna being on the calendar might mean a double Mythic revival ?

If I'm not mistaken, she was first revived one year ago.

Permanent new feature on the revivals or a special one for the Anniversary ? (I hope it's not too off topic as there might be a link to the Anniversary event)

[bolitho76]

The start of the event had they cost 2000 income on Patreon at now. And sadly I think they will not wait to christmas with this event. They had spoke from four or five time per year so I expect Halloween as the next apearance.

2 minutes ago, Gartalgar said:

Maybe Bunna being on the calendar might mean a double Mythic revival ?

It's the KC that starts and normaly the KC girl is at the calendar. That's why I pointed at Bunna as calendar girl.

Edited July 20, 2022 by bolitho76

[Incubys]

@bolitho76I was speculating that if it was a major failure to bring in money that they would take longer to re-balance it hence Christmas, however if everyone is proved wrong and KK see it as a success I can see it happening every 2 / 3 months, certainly Halloween if not before

[DvDivXXX]

2 minutes ago, Incubys said:

KK isn't a charity and is out to make money, period.

I can't put a like on your comment because of that one cliché as the opener (despite agreeing with the rest of your message). This is a really tired and profoundly flawed misconception. A company doesn't have to be either 100% good or 100% evil, in fact it's impossible and impractical to tend too heavily towards either extreme.

As I elaborated upon earlier on, there are acceptable ways to make money out of a Freemium game (convenience, acceleration, bonus resources, entirely optional and strictly visual cosmetics and more) and tons of games do it very well (even some that are notoriously owned by very greedy giant corporations with shareholders pushing for more and more billions per fiscal year). Mythics are hard to get and expensive in in-game resources, and for sure you can't get a full collection of them (yet!) as a F2P player. But they're not outright paywalled, and you can on paper catch them all eventually.

Conversely, there are unacceptable, dodgy ways to make money out of a Freemium game. Selling power and making main game content actually impossible to get without spending real money (especially a LOT, as is the case here) are definitely on top of the list, and that's what we have here with this first draft of the Seasonal Event format. Just because you're not a charity, doesn't mean you have to be a Bond villain either.

[bolitho76]

After Fribiqi had worded this so good in feedback, I wish to share it here too:

[F-L-K]

10 minutes ago, Gartalgar said:

Maybe Bunna being on the calendar might mean a double Mythic revival ?

If I'm not mistaken, she was first revived one year ago.

Permanent new feature on the revivals or a special one for the Anniversary ? (I hope it's not too off topic as there might be a link to the Anniversary event)

they will release them on the same vilain seeing their recent decisions

[EpicBacon]

I am kind of suprised they didnt make it so if you got all 4 girls you could transform her into a
Super Mythic Magical Bunny Girl.
They all got the 7 chaos toys or whatever so.. 
 

[Incubys]

11 minutes ago, DvDivXXX said:

I can't put a like on your comment because of that one cliché as the opener (despite agreeing with the rest of your message). This is a really tired and profoundly flawed misconception. A company doesn't have to be either 100% good or 100% evil, in fact it's impossible and impractical to tend too heavily towards either extreme.

I wasn't using it as a cliché merely a statement of fact, and it certainly wasn't meant as support for KK in how they operate and how they have elected to present this new feature. It was used to explain the rest of my point, that as a company out to make money they (may) have seriously miscalculated things, and won't generate the income they were expecting.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Incubys

[EpicBacon]

5 minutes ago, Incubys said:

I wasn't using it as a cliché merely a statement of fact, and it certainly wasn't meant as support for KK in how they operate and how they have elected to present this new feature. It was used to explain the rest of my point, that as a company out to make money they (may) have seriously miscalculated things, and won't generate the income they were expecting.

KK seems to "miscalculate" a lot recently.
They did one thing wich was really good, and I actually cannot remember what is was anymore :C
A lot of other changes has been.... questionable

[Yamiray]

13 minutes ago, EpicBacon said:

They all got the 7 chaos toys or whatever so.. 

The sister's look like there using the original toys. The mother's on the other hand look like they have a new set, wounder what is up with that.

[Incubys]

3 minutes ago, EpicBacon said:

KK seems to "miscalculate" a lot recently.
They did one thing wich was really good, and I actually cannot remember what is was anymore :C
A lot of other changes has been.... questionable

They do, I am siding with @DvDivXXXin hoping they come to their senses sooner rather then later and re-balance thimgs, but I'm not holding my breath .....

Edited July 20, 2022 by Incubys

[EpicBacon]

3 minutes ago, Yamiray said:

The sister's look like there using the original toys. The mother's on the other hand look like they have a new set, wounder what is up with that.

UH-OH NEW DLC CONFIRMED..
GET SEASON PASS NOW.
20.000 KOBANS.
DON'T WORRY
IT'S 4000% VALUE!

sorry bout the caps n'stuff.. this whole thing just got me slightly... displeased

Edited July 20, 2022 by EpicBacon
displeased

[Mr.S]

Just now, Yamiray said:

The sister's look like there using the original toys. The mother's on the other hand look like they have a new set, wounder what is up with that.

Well, let's pray some hyper whale decides to spend I don't know how much money so we can maybe get an explanation....

[DvDivXXX]

@Incubys Fair enough, I'm not up for a semantics witch hunt against you, sorry if I gave this impression, man. ^^

I just hate this cliché with a passion, because many players just take it at face value as the inevitable state of things and this stops them from being constructive (again not saying that's your case, on the contrary). My main point is that yes, obviously they're a business and need to make a living, but they're also a very specialized business in a niche that demands passion and creativity to even get into.

There are many contradictions in how Kinkoid operates, it's a bit of a Frankenstein monster in its own right honestly, with some parts that ooze awesomeness, community engagement, passion and talent, other parts that reek of amateurism if not plain incompetence, and plenty of parts that fluctuate in between. They still do some things like they were still a few friends in a basement working hard to get some funding for their dream project. Even things that should be handled by professionals with business and market experience instead. And some other things they leave to bureaucrats with Excel spreadsheet and raw data up to their necks that are not very reliable even as a source and then lead to very dubious "trends" once compiled as graphs, and even more questionable decision making based on that. Even when these things should be done with a much more grounded, old-school approach by staff or collaborators who are real players and know the game's experience and meta game inside out. And everything in between.

So yeah, it's not unusual for them to present a bad mixture of awesome content and terrible balance like today's new release. But more often than not, it's not done knowingly. They either don't realize or aren't aware of how much they missed the mark (until we let them know, fingers crossed that they listen).

[EpicBacon]

3 minutes ago, Mr.S said:

Well, let's pray some hyper whale decides to spend I don't know how much money so we can maybe get an explanation....

We're gonna need a bigger boat!

[EpicBacon]

1 minute ago, DvDivXXX said:

Fair enough, I'm not up for a semantics witch hunt against you, sorry if I gave this impression, man. ^^

I just hate this cliché with a passion, because many players just take it at face value as the inevitable state of things and this stops them from being constructive (again not saying that's your case, on the contrary). My main point is that yes, obviously they're a business and need to make a living, but they're also a very specialized business in a niche that demands passion and creativity to even get into.

There are many contradictions in how Kinkoid operates, it's a bit of a Frankenstein monster in its own right honestly, with some parts that ooze awesomeness, community engagement, passion and talent, other parts that reek of amateurism if not plain incompetence, and plenty of parts that fluctuate in between. They still do some things like they were still a few friends in a basement working hard to get some funding for their dream project. Even things that should be handled by professionals with business and market experience instead. And some other things they leave to bureaucrats with Excel spreadsheet and raw data up to their necks that are not very reliable even as a source and then lead to very dubious "trends" once compiled as graphs, and even more questionable decision making based on that. Even when these things should be done with a much more grounded, old-school approach by staff or collaborators who are real players and know the game's experience and meta game inside out. And everything in between. So yeah, it's not unusual for them to present a bad mixture of awesome content and terrible balance like today's new release. But more often than not, it's not done knowingly. They either don't realize or aren't aware of how much they missed the mark (until we let them know, fingers crossed that they listen).

Humans don't like the be critisised, especially if its something you value highly or is a pet project, etc.
You might start to pushback, or think that you know better, and if you dont have someone who is 
good dealing with pr, or you misspeak due to either language or miss-communication.. things can turn ugly.
Best thing would be for everyone to sit down, cool off and try to figure out a way forward.
Easier said then done, but hey one can dream.

[Incubys]

@EpicBaconit's fine, me and @DvDivXXXhave butted heads previously but on this occasion I haven't expressed by initial thought clearly enough, no hard feelings on my part. And I wasn't trying to get into a semantic debate but trying to clear up my original post. My bad, apologies all round.

Now that's over, let's get back to putting the boot into the new style event lol

[Ryujinjakka]

2 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

Of course, and that's a reasonable and frankly generous answer to the off-topic rant/whine from a very casual and/or fairly new player who knows jackshit about PvP in this game. I would have simply addressed this by saying "no off-topic and no misinformation here, thanks". And maybe directed the user to the QA section. I'll do this if any further post misses the mark by this much. Thanks anyway. If/when they're looking to add another mod to the team, you're my #1 recommendation bar none.

Off-topic rantwhine? Very casual/fairly new player? ok. been playing since APRIL,  26 2017....

just because I dont spend time in the foruns doesnt mean I know 'jack shit' about PvP...but ok. i'll let myself out.

Just another sweet reason to not spend any time in here when you comment on a very heated topic on how things are degenerating on the PVP side of things and get this kind of comment from a modd...but yeah...Im turning even more casual after this. Thanks for the comment.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Ryujinjakka

[EpicBacon]

1 minute ago, Incubys said:

@EpicBaconit's fine, me and @DvDivXXXhave butted heads previously but on this occasion I haven't expressed by initial thought clearly enough, no hard feelings on my part. And I wasn't trying to get into a semantic debate but trying to clear up my original post. My bad, apologies all round.

Now that's over, let's get back to putting the boot into the new style event lol

Oh, no no no no! I didnt mean you, I was thinking about KK.
And how they might feel about the "not-so-constructive-feedback"
I should have specified that, apologies