Rasec Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 (edited) in my opinion I think the less gamble it has the better or at least, add a minimum amount you can gain, that being zero really sucks for unlucky people like me Edited February 20, 2019 by Rasec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobaT Posted February 20, 2019 Share Posted February 20, 2019 It changed from gamble to p2w. I can't invest a lot of kobans in every new girl. I save them for the epic pachinko and I will never buy them (2760 kobans for 20€ are a joke). Yes, I didn't get every girl in the old system, but got a lot without spending a single koban (well sometimes for one or two refills, but you get my point). The new system is far away from helping "unlucky" players, it just hurts people who don't invest a lot of kobans. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZackMacKenzie Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Just now, BobaT said: It changed from gamble to p2w. I profoundly disagree. It was always p2w game. I've spent nothing on this game and at no point did I think there was ANY realistic chance to keep pace with the small-time payers let alone the whales. I played because I could do well enough, and saw it as a challenge to try and compete in a game stacked against me. If I've had great results so far it's been sheer luck and maybe some good decisions here and there, not because the game wasn't p2w. How lucky have I been? I haven't failed to score at least ONE girl in every event since I started (53 girls, 3 months, 1 week). That's not to say that I haven't had frustratingly long dry spells or that I've never had to spend kobans to achieve that result. I mean, that is what they're there for! And I already know that the streak WILL end. Too many people have posted all too often about going several events without nabbing a girl for their harem to believe otherwise. And when that happens, you better believe that I'll be glad that a shard system is in place instead of having to start all over again. (IMHO) Sooner is better than later but later is at least as much better than never! Ultimately, opinion comes down to perception and personality. A person with high expectations is more likely to be disappointed by things failing to meet those expectations, and a person will low expectations is more likely to be pleasantly surprised when things exceed their expectations. This will even occur when they receive the same results overall! In our case, the main aspects of perception in play are how positively we value the excitement of achieving rare positive events; how positively we value the avoidance of common negative events (or how frustrated we are by common negative events); expectations based on our early experience (AKA conditioning); how we view change in general assessments of blame and responsibility. If you value 1 more than 2, you will probably prefer the old system even if the empirical results show it is worse. You probably like playing the lottery or slots. Tedium doesn't bother you and you live for that ecstatic high. If you value 2 more than 1, you will probably prefer the new system even if the empirical results show it is worse. You'd probably prefer blackjack — in all likelihood you'll still lose your money, but endless stretches of losing won't be anywhere near the problem as slots or lotteries. Number 3 is more complicated. If your early experiences with HH involved a healthy share of good luck, you will perceive negatively anything that may end that roll. You'll also be more likely to view a downturn in luck more negatively without any change in the system. This is where conspiracy theories are born. If your early experiences with HH involved a healthy share of bad luck, well, you might not be here to read this as you've likely walked away already. If you stuck it out, you'd perceive positively anything that could mitigate that bad luck, and would celebrate a change in luck even without a change in the system. In the long run, both these players results will look very similar, assuming their play style is similar, but their perception of the game's 'direction' generally reflects their early experience. Number 4 is a toughie. We're hard-wired for routines so mostly view change as a bad thing until it can be proven otherwise. Some of us have had such terrible, traumatic experiences with change that we find it hard to ever accept change, even when it has already been proven to be positive. There are people who view change as more of a neutral thing — a mixed bag of positive and negative, every one judged individually on its own merits. There are virtually no people at all that see change as generally preferable to routine! Pretty much the only time change is viewed positively by default is when we are bored, i.e. in a rut, and then the change has to be our decision and under our own control. It is notoriously hard to separate our emotions and instinctive distrust of change from our judgement. What makes people different is how much value they place in trying. #5 is about how we tend to attribute blame and responsibility instinctively. To protect our egos, which is generally a healthy thing to do, we'll often assign blame to external sources even when we've been the architects of our own failure. Similarly, we're quicker to take responsibility for positive outcomes even when we had little or no influence on them. How much of this occurs varies from person to person. What almost never occurs is self-reflection after the fact — were we reasonable or unreasonable in taking ownership or deflecting blame? There isn't a single person that wouldn't benefit from occasionally examining that particular behavior. To connect this to the situation at hand, there are almost certainly some that have seen an improvement in results and have attributed that to "I'm playing better" rather than "the game has changed for the better". Likewise, there are almost certainly those who have made bad choices and are blaming the game rather than our play strategies. If you see yourself in any of these characterizations, try to take a step back and look at things as objectively as you can, considering your experience as a whole rather than segments of good or bad. You may still feel the same way, but you might be surprised and find yourself seeing things in a more moderate, measured way. Even if you don't, you'll almost certainly be better equipped to support your opinion than if you impulsively post on a high or a low. Personally, this is why I keep such extensive statistics of my play. I know how likely I am to see things negatively if I rely on my emotional perception! The only way to keep myself from being down on everything all the time is to track things meticulously. Then, if I have a strong feeling one way or another I can check to see if the numbers actually support that feeling. A lot of people don't like stats, quoting "lies, damned lies and statistics." It is true that a person who wants to push an ideology can cherry-pick the numbers to present them in a way that at least superficially supports their point of view, and conveniently 'misplace' the inconvenient data that doesn't. You know who won't do that to you? You. You can always trust your own documented statistics as long as you track everything. If you forget from time to time you're either more likely to remember when things are going bad than good or vice versa, and your numbers will be skewed. Doing this takes a certain amount of patience and discipline, but it also helps develop patience and discipline, two traits that are sorely lacking in the age of social media. Just things to think about, if that's your thing. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cantrix Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 7 hours ago, Vulture said: Who wants to spend a year dating shards lol. Maybe this uninteresting Legendary will come back sooner, but what about the calendar locked events? I'm still salty about Val Shao as she was on my wishlist and the last day of event fiasco happened. If this persist on a larger scale I can see a decline in the player pool before the next Valentine revival. If you wanted her so much, why didn't you spend kobans on her? I have spend 3k kobans on herр because i wanted her and i don't regret a single one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cantrix Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 7 hours ago, Vulture said: Who wants to spend a year dating shards lol. Maybe this uninteresting Legendary will come back sooner, but what about the calendar locked events? I'm still salty about Val Shao as she was on my wishlist and the last day of event fiasco happened. If this persist on a larger scale I can see a decline in the player pool before the next Valentine revival. If you wanted her so much, why didn't you spend kobans on her? I have spend 3k kobans on herр because i wanted her and i don't regret a single one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhans Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 54 minutes ago, Cantrix said: If you wanted her so much, why didn't you spend kobans on her? I have spend 3k kobans on herр because i wanted her and i don't regret a single one. Déjà vu. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhans Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 2 hours ago, ZackMacKenzie said: It was always p2w game. Yep it is. But they also have to keep freebiers happy otherwise p2w people wouldn't have anyone to beat on easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Blaster Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 I've always had very good luck getting the event girls. I hate the fact these shards take away income. It should be a bonus on top of income. From what i've seen so far... getting shards over all has netted me lot lower chance to obtain event girls. The system is not working as intended or it is and it's turned this into even a more of a grind fest than it was before. You can argue the metrics all you want.... the end result is, This is NOT fun. Now it's just even more confusing and lot bigger drawbacks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowman22 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 @BobaT, It was always p2w, but you have to admit Kinkoid is nicer to their free players than many games. I have played many "free" games where 2 hours in it is impossible to progress without spending cash. The free players here get a pretty good deal. They can access 99.9% of the content (there are a few patron only girls) and there is no free player level cap. The only penalty a free player pays is it takes longer to do things. Yes the paying players progress a little faster but they are the reason the game still exists so "yeaaa paying players, you da man, please, enjoy being 10 levels ahead of me, you deserve it". @ZackMacKenzie 5 hours ago, ZackMacKenzie said: Personally, this is why I keep such extensive statistics of my play. This. Humans are really bad at gut feeling statistics. Just about everybody thinks they are excellent at seeing trends and remembering stats. Almost nobody is. It is as if there was some advantage back in time to being rubbish at statistics but thinking you where good at it. I was convinced the market was showing me Charm/HC vs KH epics at about 4:1. So I started keeping track. Nope. Pretty even. Any time I see someone saying "Other people report X and I have no records to support my claim but my feels say Y, so the game is bad because Y" I pretty much write their comment off. I get that keeping stats is not for everyone. Mostly I don't. But I do not understand ragging on a stats based game with zero evidence to back up your claims. (This is NOT directed at BobaT, BobaT did NOT make any unsubstantiated claims, it is an extension of what ZackMacKenzie was saying.) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobaT Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 I still have to disagree. It's not a "little" faster when you can spend 5k Kobans for every girl. I don't care about PVP, the leauges or whatever. I only collect girls and follow the story. I almost play for 2 years now and I got a lot of girls without paying a single koban (atleast 85/91 of my girls). I have to admit that we only have seen 2 and 1/4 events with the the new system, but I wasn't very lucky. I got 60 shards for Val Abrael, playing like always. I already had Val Red Battler, but my point is that I wouldn't even have the chance to get her in this event. Idk, maybe I'm just unlucky now, but I still think the old system was better regarding this point. In the last couple of months I started to invest kobans for 10x perfomances, because the old system was less "smooth". Atleast this is better now. Anyway, i don't complain about my drop rates in the past. i don't need every girl. But most of the time I could get atleast one (I talk about the normal 12 days events and epic days). I will see how much luck I have next month. Epic Days: i doubt I will get one girl (or even two) out of it now. I just can't collect enough shards in 4 days without investing kobans (except I have the luck of my life I guess). Legendary Days: They were always hit or miss. Got atleast 3 of 6 girls and that's ok. I didn't play much during this event, so I can't really talk about it. 5 hours ago, Cantrix said: If you wanted her so much, why didn't you spend kobans on her? I have spend 3k kobans on herр because i wanted her and i don't regret a single one. Well this works. But only one time in like 6 months. i wouldn't have a lot kobans for a long time. I have the feeling I have to this for every girl now. @Master Blaster I agree, having the same feeling. My point: i don't see how the new system helps me. It maybe helps to get one girl, but that's all of it. Event with 2 girls (or more) are probably impossible without paying for kobans. The old system was far from perfect, but I have the feeling the lucky part was better than now and was less of a grind. As I said I don't care about PvP, just collecting girls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhans Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 38 minutes ago, snowman22 said: But I do not understand ragging on a stats based game with zero evidence to back up your claims. You don't need facts to complain. Fake news and all that. 4 minutes ago, BobaT said: The old system was far from perfect, but I have the feeling the lucky part was better than now and was less of a grind. It used to be like a casino with the occasional jackpots. Now it's a job. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_shal_ Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Lhans said: It used to be like a casino with the occasional jackpots. Now it's a job. Did you never have to battle 500+ times for a girl under the old system? The potential for grind was always there, it's largely just been spread more equally between players now. And as for it feeling like a job now, presumably because there's now a progress indicator that reminds you how long you've already been at it - if you didn't have that feeling before, I'd rather think you were a bit too much into the gambling aspect of it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernos Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Can we get stats about the droprate ? Not what you coded, the result post event. This would shut any complaints to know the kind of rate we can expect for shards and ladies. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YummyTiger Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 5 hours ago, BobaT said: I already had Val Red Battler, but my point is that I wouldn't even have the chance to get her in this event. Idk, maybe I'm just unlucky now, but I still think the old system was better regarding this point. You still have a chance to get 100 affection instantly for any girl. We don't even know how much that chance has dropped (or if it has dropped), it's all assumption at this point. I got Fabienne in and instant drop and got one of the trolls in an instant drop a day before. Truly free players who never refilled would have missed most epics and legendaries in the prior system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johntrine Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 aaaahhh yes... i came back and noticed the devs took 2 steps forward with kinda okish managing the event pachinco shit and then they turned around and flew back a million light years... HOW!!! HOW DO YOU FUCK UP SOOOO BAD EVERYTIME!!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhans Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 5 hours ago, _shal_ said: I'd rather think you were a bit too much into the gambling aspect of it. I miss the jackpots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcivo Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 I don't know is that a bug but that was nice Anyway new system is kindy weird today for the legendaray girl I had only 23/100 so i had to spend 4,000 kobans to be sure to get her ;/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambit126 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 Not a bug. Looks like you got the lucky 100 shard instant girl drop. Congratulations. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jyepie Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 14 hours ago, Master Blaster said: I've always had very good luck getting the event girls. I hate the fact these shards take away income. It should be a bonus on top of income. From what i've seen so far... getting shards over all has netted me lot lower chance to obtain event girls. The system is not working as intended or it is and it's turned this into even a more of a grind fest than it was before. You can argue the metrics all you want.... the end result is, This is NOT fun. Now it's just even more confusing and lot bigger drawbacks. Theres no way to get event girls now without spending a lot of kobans. The devs found the perfect way to make people use all their kobans. Theres no way to get both event girls now. You might not even get one. Shards dont drop easily for everyone. Theres going to be a lot of people with bad luck And then a small group of very few lucky people will come here to the forum to brag about their great shard drops and try to call the unlucky people whiners.... Which already happens. This new system officially kills the event girls for anyone not using kobans. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chthugha Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 9 minutes ago, jyepie said: Theres no way to get event girls now without spending a lot of kobans. The devs found the perfect way to make people use all their kobans. Theres no way to get both event girls now. You might not even get one. Shards dont drop easily for everyone. Theres going to be a lot of people with bad luck And then a small group of very few lucky people will come here to the forum to brag about their great shard drops and try to call the unlucky people whiners.... Which already happens. This new system officially kills the event girls for anyone not using kobans. Oh right, because we've been playing with this system for ages now, so we can absolutely say that it's going to be impossible to get the girls. We've had 2 events. One is a legendary days, which always had a pityful chance on obtaining the girl without using kobans, the other is a revival event of just 5 days. That event is to give people a chance to get old event girls. They don't even have to do those kind of events. From what I've seen, it's still very likely to get a girl in those 5-day revival events, so I'm not sure what you've been looking at. And when it comes to the koban argument... You get a ton of free kobans from the game. As long as people keep talking about those free kobans, then you seriously need to reconsider. You collect those kobans to get girls you otherwise wouldn't be able to get, so why wouldn't you use them for that? I really don't see the problem. I don't hear anybody complain about having to use in-game money to buy books or stat upgrades. It's because that's what you use that money for; getting new stuff that makes your account better. Just for fun: keep a record of all the kobans you gain (how did you gain them), and how you spend them (and on what). There are so many players who waste them on things you don't have to waste them on. Refills aren't a waste if they lead to the girl, which with this shard system is more likely to happen than with the old system. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mhd001144 Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 On 2/20/2019 at 3:18 AM, GeorgeMTO said: The event pachinko had no changes under the attraction system. It works exactly the same as it did before, except it awards shards instead of the directly giving the girl. It's shitiness is unrelated to the attraction system The Event Pachinko will give 100 Attraction points So this line is not about the same topic!?? " Patch Notes 12/02/19" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J0ko Posted February 21, 2019 Share Posted February 21, 2019 For me to get the new girl Fabienne i had to fight so much in so little time, since the event is only 5 days it's absolutely impossible to get here without having extreme luck or without spending hundreds of Kobans. This system is a joke right now it needs some serious balancing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Observer_X Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 There is a thought that hit me a couple hours ago that I would like to share. KH players are free to hate me after this, but I think that, if really in a couple of months we will get a legendary revival as it was for Levitya, Norou and Fanny&Fione, the KH players who did not get Fabienne will start favorited, while other specialty players that in the past had not gained their needed girl (Golden Bunny or Taria the Champion) will start too excessively penalized, being a fact that they spent time and resource in the past to obtain their specialty girls (failing) but in the revival they start at 0 shards while Fabienne hunters will start with a number of shards in their pockets. All this makes me think that, given the rarity and power of legendary girls, it would have been more equilibrated to introduce the new shard system the next month. This way at the next legendary revival all players who did not catch their needed girl would all start on an equal footing. But having seen how things had been in the past, I suppose that asking for equity in this game is like asking a blind form birth to describe a painting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeMTO Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 hours ago, mhd001144 said: The Event Pachinko will give 100 Attraction points So this line is not about the same topic!?? " Patch Notes 12/02/19" Previously it awarded a full girl, now it awards 100 shards, which is the equivalent of a full girl. It functions exactly the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lhans Posted February 22, 2019 Share Posted February 22, 2019 2 hours ago, Chthugha said: There are so many players who waste them on things you don't have to waste them on. Refills aren't a waste if they lead to the girl, which with this shard system is more likely to happen than with the old system. So would spending about 3.2k Nutaku kobans (19200HH) for Karole's girls be a waste or no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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