[Mythic Booster] [Player XP] Alban's Travel Memories Needs A BUFF

[DvDivXXX]

Hey Kinkoid staff, hey fellow mods, hey HH(/GH/etc.) community. Hey @Noacc in particular (for the ping! ^^). Hope you're all well.

So. On the 8th of September 2021, a billion years ago (basically as soon as it became available), I've equipped this item:

I don't mean "this item type". THIS specific item (I bought two more copies on the same day, before it really sunk in for me just how slow and barely noticeable they would be).

I'm a fairly active player, I don't miss out on any XP ever if I can help it. A few regular D3 winners likely already finished their first copy of this and equipped the one for the subsequent trimester (because they seldom have any lost fights in leagues, so they earn a bit more XP than I do). Mine should finally run out in a few days, perhaps even exactly on the day we'll celebrate its introduction, matching the bitter sweet prediction we made when Mythic Boosters were announced: THREE MONTHS to gain 100k XP,  aka nowhere near enough for even ONE LEVEL, and that ratio is only going to get worse as I slowly keep leveling up.

I don't think this item performs well enough in its current state, to say the least. Do you? I mean, there's no reason not to have one equipped at all times until you've reached the Player Level cap. 540 kobans every three months is barely noticeable on any budget, and Player XP is so ridiculously scarce in this game that every tiny bit counts. But is that satisfactory for anyone? I don't think so.

As a player, I can completely forget about it except for a few days every three months, just to make sure I equip the next one as soon as the slot finally reopens. That's not exciting, engaging or anything. It's a net positive, so I still use it, but it certainly doesn't feel like a MYTHIC BOOSTER. And its impact on my hopelessly slow grind to level up barely registers. On top of that, since it's just as likely to show up in my Market as any other item (despite only being able to use up to FOUR COPIES A YEAR)... which is depressing and those unneeded (and unusable) extra copies offered to me just take spots of items I could actually have a demand for. That's a pretty big Fail.

As game developers, does a 540-koban item that any decent active player will only purchase 4 times a year really justify its existence? Wouldn't it be more interesting and better for the game's economy and overall balance to change it so that it actually has an impact, perhaps even generates revenues? Not to mention the positive vibes you could give to (and receive from) a large part of your player base with a better design for this item? I can't picture any scenario in which it would NOT be a good change for you guys to consider.

The reduction from the base +20% down to a measly +5% fairly soon after the level cap at which a player's account already starts leveling up much slower seems utterly counterproductive to me. What purpose does this serve? 

Perhaps this item can give a big boost if you want to power-level a brand-new account? Not really. You level up every other 5 minutes from levels 1 to 150, then at least once a day until 201 or 251 (can't remember for sure and can't find the archived relevant patch notes). Then it's every other day, and it keeps slowly slowing down until somewhere around level 301 (or is it 401?) at which points the XP boosts shrinks down to an XP minus. I've heard through the grapevine (so I'll take it with a grain of salt) that Rosso mentioned something about new players taking around 6 months to reach level 200. That's either based on really old data, from before the patch that gave massive XP boosts to low levels around a year and a half ago or, if it's actualy recent data, then it simply goes to show that a vast majority of new players are extremely casual and/or don't know what they're doing yet. In practice, a good player who understands the game core mechanics well enough can easily bring a brand-new account to level 200 in a couple of weeks or so, without much effort. Level 150 in particular takes a couple days or so. That's without the +20% from an item that costs a lot of kobans for a brand-new account, especially since at that rate, you'd burn through it relatively quick, too. And then what? You've burned 2-3k in kobans to reach level 300 a few months earlier? To say this doesn't seem worth it would be a +20% understatement, to say the least. ^^

There's no legit reason left to bottleneck the XP bottleneck even further, quite the contrary imho. Any PvP balance argument anyone might have had to support such an overhanded restriction went out the window the moment you guys introduced the game-changing patch which made it possible for a low-level whale to outperform high-level veterans on a budget. That's not rhetorical or imaginary, by the way. It's already happening. A level 357 made a Top 4 in D3 riding a full team of 7 mythics at level 550 two weeks ago, and a level 434 already had a full team of 7 mythics at level 650 a few days ago, whereas a pretty hardcore level 444 who happens to be pretty tight money wise IRL, such as yours truly, is still tediously working towards unlocking level 600 at all, and is nowhere near being able to afford upgrading and leveling up the final 2 of their 7 mythics to 550 (I'm making do with 5 at this time). So yeah, you can already pay to win in this game through this alone. Besides, Rosso went on the record agreeing (two years too late, but better late than never) with the forum community's assessment that an "older account? you win!" PvP system was anything but balanced, fair or desirable.

So, why would you still want to block players who'd like to gain Player Levels faster? There's an item in the game that could actually be helpful if you were to un-nerf it. 20% throughout seems fine (not great, mind you, just fine). We can only use one at a time, bear in mind, and "4 times faster than 3 months" to grab 100k XP (aka a droplet in the ocean of what you need to reach the last hundred levels or so) doesn't sound like Quicksilver and The Flash taking over the game to me. We'd each buy one copy every 3 weeks instead of every 3 months, give or take. That's still slow, but not depressingly so. You could even buff it to 50% and it would still not be a problem. If new players with deep pockets want to finance the game and that also includes purchasing tons of Alban's Travel Memories, let them. It would be a good thing for the game and community in the long run. While also offering an out to long-time dedicated players of all budgets who aren't particularly excited about grinding another year or more to finally reach Player Level 500, and get rid of one of the main handicaps they've had from Day One of their journey into this game. Win-win.

Please, pretty please with cherry on top, take this under serious advisement. Preferably sooner rather than in two years. Many thanks in advance and let us (the most dedicated part of the player community and you guys, the game makers) keep communicating, interacting and helping each other out for the health and future of this game(s) we all love. Cheers.

[natstar]

They could at least give us another mythic booster slot if they're not going to increase the exp boost because been stuck on 2 mythic booster slots because this booster takes months for end.

[Liliat]

Can't agree more. For me it will be 4 months between each book. I wouldn't mind a +20% rate instead of +5% (I also don't understand why it goes from 20% to 5% at level 300. It's not like we're gonna reach the end game any time soon, with or without a +20% buff).

[Kaitana]

Experience is less important now than when this booster was introduced, so of course it should be updated.

[Attirm]

Hah, I've still got 18k yet to go on mine. My slow pace is due to being in D2 for the first several weeks after the booster released. The meta in D2 (at least before the rewards change) was to stop taking fights once you were in 16th place and wait for someone to pass you before continuing to fight. Now that I'm in D3 I'm leveling up way faster, about 5 times per month instead of 4 times per month.

I'm not convinced the Travel Memoir is worth even its rather low kobon cost. I'm probably 18 months away from level 500 at this point. If I activate one travel memoire every 3 months that will be 6 memoirs, or 540 nubons in that time. Would I rather have 540 extra nubons saved up, or have to wait less than one extra month to reach level 500? Honestly, I'm kinda leaning towards the Nubons. Sure, I will be a little bit stronger along the way, but now that girl level is no longer connected to player level that's just equipment and player stats which aren't as significant. 

Now with that said, if it were buffed to +20% for all players regardless of level it might become necessary to win XP contests like day 1 of Legendary Contests. There is over 300k XP up for grabs between Seasons and Path of Valor, and a 20% boost on that is worth 60k experience all on its own. Given that XP contests are usually 10 points per experience, that means having a Memoir equipped would give you 600k extra on your contest results. That could very well become the Legendary Contest day 1 equivalent of the All Mastery Emblem. I don't like the prospects of that.

I don't really have much opinion on the booster shop stock. It's not like I utilize the booster shop very often. In fact, I never utilized the shop at all before Mythic Boosters were a thing, and the only booster I've bought more than one copy of to date is Sandalwood. 

11 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

 level 357 made a Top 4 in D3 riding a full team of 7 mythics at level 550 two weeks ago

I'm scratching my head wondering about these anecdotal accounts, because it's not the first time I've seen them and it's completely the opposite of what I'm seeing in my leagues. In my D3 league I'm not seeing anyone below level 450 take top 4, and there are only 3 players in my current league below level 400 at all. There are a few people who rush up there in the first half of the week but they're gone by the second half. Top spots are still predominantly going to level 500's and 490's. While some people have definitely fallen behind with their awakenings and others have gotten ahead, it's mostly business as usual with the the highest level players taking the top spots and the lower-level underdogs are just barely poking their head into the top 15. This may change in time, as those who collect gems faster and manage their resources better (and more bundles get released...) get further ahead, but for now the higher-level players got a higher-level grandfather and are doing just fine for themselves in my leagues.

Maybe this has something to do with the difference between Nutaku and Kinkoid? We do have different demographics and level spreads; Nutaku only just got our first level 500's relatively recently. Maybe that leads to a completely different culture in our D3 leagues that makes top-15 more competitive and harder to break into by lower-level players who did a bunch of awakenings? I'm just trying to look for an explanation for our radically different observations.

[DvDivXXX]

3 hours ago, Attirm said:

having a Memoir equipped would give you 600k extra on your contest results. That could very well become the Legendary Contest day 1 equivalent of the All Mastery Emblem. I don't like the prospects of that.

Any serious player has an XP booster equipped anyway, so no. This wouldn't change anything for contests or any XP-related task (all the usual scores take a +15% compared to the current situation, and the rankings don't change at all).

3 hours ago, Attirm said:

I'm scratching my head wondering about these anecdotal accounts, because it's not the first time I've seen them and it's completely the opposite of what I'm seeing in my leagues.

Yes, these are exceptional cases, not what everyone sees by default. We don't have "radically different observations" just because we saw a few outstanding cases and you haven't. That's why we post them when we encounter them (so far). I've cited them to make a point. I didn't mean to imply that my D3 is plagued with millionaires who just started the game and paid their way into D3's top 4. But everything is ready for them, and we already saw a few actual cases. That was the whole point. ^^ D3 on .com is still vastly dominated by the usual veterans and/or expert and extremely dedicated semi-veteran players. And the lower level with the 7 level 650 mythic team didn't break top 4 that week despite this advantage (you can follow the links in my OP to read more about these specific cases if you're curious). It takes practice and planning too, not just a stats advantage.

4 hours ago, Attirm said:

Maybe this has something to do with the difference between Nutaku and Kinkoid? We do have different demographics and level spreads [...]

Yes, Nutaku is a significantly softer meta than HH. It's been the case for years. But this doesn't change the above for either server.

[Kenrae]

FWIW

I'm at level 492 right now. Guess I'll use one more and that will be the last one ever.

[Magic1986]

i equipped one the day they were released and mine still got 15k xp left. thats just useless

28 minutes ago, Kenrae said:

FWIW

I'm at level 492 right now. Guess I'll use one more and that will be the last one ever.

unless level 600 gets announced

Edited December 6, 2021 by Magic1986

[JustVisitingReborn]

2 hours ago, Kenrae said:

I'm at level 492 right now. Guess I'll use one more and that will be the last one ever.

You not think it's worth more than the cost for the increased chances of winning the XP based DC and LC?

 

[Kenrae]

16 minutes ago, JustVisitingReborn said:

You not think it's worth more than the cost for the increased chances of winning the XP based DC and LC?

 

I don't think me getting the LC girl depends on that 5% increase in XP, to be honest. Same with DC, the difference is so small...

[Attirm]

On 12/6/2021 at 10:37 AM, Kenrae said:

I don't think me getting the LC girl depends on that 5% increase in XP, to be honest. Same with DC, the difference is so small...

It's not so much getting the girl, it's taking top 4 on Day 1 that's the big deal. That doesn't just increase your winnings, it means that on day 2 you're eligible to win mythic orbs. And with how long it currently lasts, one of these will cover you for at least 3 Legendary Contests. Given that XP is the biggest score determinant on day 1 and it's only going to get more extreme with PoV, there's a fair argument to be made that the Memoirs are now worthwhile even for level 500's for an edge in the contests.

[DvDivXXX]

As expected, I finally equipped my second copy of this wonderful item today, so the first one took exactly 3 months to deliver its amazing 100k XP payload...

I hope this gets on Rosso's desk.

[Kenrae]

8 hours ago, Attirm said:

It's not so much getting the girl, it's taking top 4 on Day 1 that's the big deal. That doesn't just increase your winnings, it means that on day 2 you're eligible to win mythic orbs. And with how long it currently lasts, one of these will cover you for at least 3 Legendary Contests. Given that XP is the biggest score determinant on day 1 and it's only going to get more extreme with PoV, there's a fair argument to be made that the Memoirs are now worthwhile even for level 500's for an edge in the contests.

To be honest, the mythic orbs you get on LC after you get the girl are something quite small for a high level player. I currently have more than 800 single orbs and many x3 and x6.

[jelom]

3 hours ago, Kenrae said:

To be honest, the mythic orbs you get on LC after you get the girl are something quite small for a high level player. I currently have more than 800 single orbs and many x3 and x6.

You forgot to add that a high level player has got so many girls that it can pass months after a girl appears for him in the Mythic Pachinko, so the orbs keep piling in his inventory

[JustVisitingReborn]

3 hours ago, Kenrae said:

To be honest, the mythic orbs you get on LC after you get the girl are something quite small for a high level player. I currently have more than 800 single orbs and many x3 and x6.

Agreed, but I would still take any edge I could get for the Kobans in the DCs. Certainly at level 361 that 5% made a difference to me on several occassions, allowing me to hold back an XP pack from Seasons that I would have otherwise had to spend. With the 'bracket of doom' being so much more competitive, I would have thought that every little advantage would be worth keeping and given that 'gain XP' DCs are one of the most common types, this is a boost that comes into play regularly.

I long ago stopped making any effort to get the MP orbs from the LC after gaining the girl. Given that others are still competing for the girl, the price in resources to win the orbs is waaaay too high, and I could deploy those resources for Koban on other days.

I've also managed to save up over 800 single orbs and a fair number of 3/6, but that's because I'm specifically banking to ensure I always have enough to snipe any 5*s that come along. I could empty that wallet in a matter of days if I was just to spend them every time there was a girl available.

[Attirm]

4 hours ago, Kenrae said:

To be honest, the mythic orbs you get on LC after you get the girl are something quite small for a high level player. I currently have more than 800 single orbs and many x3 and x6.

800 single orbs? Do you not spend them when girls become available in mythic pachinko? It is rare for a high-level player to find a girl they want in Mythic Pachinko, but it can take up to 200 orbs to get her since the drop rate is so low. It's very easy to burn through even a large stash. I just spent about 160 mythic orbs to get one girl to drop in mythic pachinko, only have 25 left. So you need loads of them to get anything out of there.

The 3-spin and 6-spin are something to hoard, but you do want to keep a stockpile of them so you can guarantee a girl you want. The single orbs just have too low a drop rate, so if a must-have comes around in the pachinko you need to have 3-spins and 6-spins available (and preferably enough to get two girls because you know some trash girl you don't have will be in rotation at the same time as the girl you've been waiting for).

Edited December 8, 2021 by Attirm

[Zteev]

7 hours ago, Attirm said:

800 single orbs? Do you not spend them when girls become available in mythic pachinko? It is rare for a high-level player to find a girl they want in Mythic Pachinko, but it can take up to 200 orbs to get her since the drop rate is so low. It's very easy to burn through even a large stash. I just spent about 160 mythic orbs to get one girl to drop in mythic pachinko, only have 25 left. So you need loads of them to get anything out of there.

The 3-spin and 6-spin are something to hoard, but you do want to keep a stockpile of them so you can guarantee a girl you want. The single orbs just have too low a drop rate, so if a must-have comes around in the pachinko you need to have 3-spins and 6-spins available (and preferably enough to get two girls because you know some trash girl you don't have will be in rotation at the same time as the girl you've been waiting for).

If you check the Mythic Pachinko tracking thread here:

you'll find DvDivXXX tracking the girls available to them. It's pretty frequent that there isn't a girl available.

Personally on the subject of the XP booster, it's more or less fine as-is, I feel. The fact that it's really good for lower level players trying to catch up, and not so good for us high level players.

 

 

[430i]

Level 300 is long way from catching up, so it would make sense to add an intermediate level from 300 to 400 where it gives a 10% bonus

[natstar]

6 hours ago, Zteev said:

If you check the Mythic Pachinko tracking thread here:

you'll find DvDivXXX tracking the girls available to them. It's pretty frequent that there isn't a girl available.

Personally on the subject of the XP booster, it's more or less fine as-is, I feel. The fact that it's really good for lower level players trying to catch up, and not so good for us high level players.

 

 

It's not fine because it takes way to long to expire due to the exp gain being so slow after level 300 so you lose a mythic booster slot for the 3 months it takes to use up making it annoying during mythic days, if you have the champ damage booster equipped for club champ fights and an am booster (waiting for people to not have boosters on then cannot use sandlewood booster forcing you to fight boosted players just to use the am booster up to be able to equip one

Giving more exp boost after level 300 would make the booster expire faster meaning people would buy more of the booster before getting level 500 and we are also stuck with gem system due to people leveling up to slowly making them complain about not being able to win fights at lower levels

That is why i said in the second post in this topic that they could at least give us another mythic booster slot if they're not going to increase the exp boost because been stuck on 2 mythic booster slots because this booster taking months to end is really annoying.

Edited December 9, 2021 by natstar

[FinderKeeper]

(It might be hard on the UI implementation but) It would make sense to just give a separate mythic slots section for all types of mythic boosters together.

Limiting number of mythic slots did not promote any good strategic plays, I think. I look at it as a UI inconvenience.

[Kenrae]

19 hours ago, Attirm said:

800 single orbs? Do you not spend them when girls become available in mythic pachinko?

I always do. It's once a month or so 😅

In fact, I've used them in pachinko contests even without having an available girl.

[Attirm]

25 minutes ago, Kenrae said:

I always do. It's once a month or so 😅

In fact, I've used them in pachinko contests even without having an available girl.

You must have close to a complete collection then (at least among the girls in the Mythic Pachinko rotation) because I get girls often enough to completely deplete my mythic orb stash, and I won't necessarily take the opportunity when one shows up if it's not one I want. It's not like my harem is small, either, it's 674 girls.

[DvDivXXX]

@Attirm Sure, 600+ girls is not a small number, but active veterans like Ken who dominated D3 back when it was cool have a good +40% on you in that regard. And most of those are in regular MP rotation, indeed (all the permanent EP girls for one thing, but also most past event girls). That's a big difference.

[Attirm]

9 hours ago, DvDivXXX said:

@Attirm Sure, 600+ girls is not a small number, but active veterans like Ken who dominated D3 back when it was cool have a good +40% on you in that regard. And most of those are in regular MP rotation, indeed (all the permanent EP girls for one thing, but also most past event girls). That's a big difference.

That's understandable from Kenrae's position then, but most high-level players aren't in the same boat. We never had and never will have the big D3 payouts. For events both past and future we have to prioritize what we want and let some pass by. Going forward the kobon sinks are only getting more expensive, which will only exacerbate this. I've already got years worth of events where I only got some of the girls. While I may have to wait for them to show up in Mythic Pachinko, it's very unlikely that I will ever run out of uses for Mythic orbs.

Edited December 10, 2021 by Attirm

[Kenrae]

On 12/10/2021 at 6:30 PM, Attirm said:

That's understandable from Kenrae's position then, but most high-level players aren't in the same boat. We never had and never will have the big D3 payouts. For events both past and future we have to prioritize what we want and let some pass by. Going forward the kobon sinks are only getting more expensive, which will only exacerbate this. I've already got years worth of events where I only got some of the girls. While I may have to wait for them to show up in Mythic Pachinko, it's very unlikely that I will ever run out of uses for Mythic orbs.

FYI, I have 927 girls right now. And there are people with more girls than me, I've always been a second tier player, a usual D3 top 4 finisher but "only" occasional winner. Those who are already at level 500 and have been good players for a long time have nearly all available girls.